Different tonewoods that sound similar

[palsed]

Has anyone noticed even though guitars have different tonewoods, the sound isn't all that different? For example, my GC Taylor Spruce/Koa has a very similar tone to a GC Taylor Cedar/Mahogany. They project differently but the combination of woods result in similar tones, at least to my ears.

Anyone else find that different combos yield similar tones?

Kinda supports the philosophy that the builder affects the tone more than the wood does. I've played a mahogany and a rosewood J-45, and while different, they both still sounded like J-45s.

[Jaden]

I do notice my 000-18 has more overtones than my om-21. The 18 has enveloping projection with rich midrange and bass, the 21 stricter, brighter. They are different and don’t fit the common observation of rosewood having more overtones.

[Alan Carruth]

To the extent that different woods affect the tone (which may not be much) it's probably a matter of the wood properties. Woods with similar density and Young's modulus (stiffness) tend to produce similar sound. Damping, the way the wood rings when it's tapped, ought to have some bearing as well, but so far as I've been able to tell, density seems to be more important. It's possible that damping sets a limit to what you can get, but doesn't help if you mess up and make the guitar wrong. It's distressingly easy to make a bad guitar from good wood. OTOH, a really good maker can make a good guitar out of any excuse for wood. It might be possible to get a 'rosewood' sort of sound from mahogany, particularly if it's on the dense side, but in general if you want the sound of rosewood it's easier to get if you start off with something that's like a rosewood.

[BrunoBlack]

Originally Posted by Alan Carruth

To the extent that different woods affect the tone (which may not be much) it's probably a matter of the wood properties. Woods with similar density and Young's modulus (stiffness) tend to produce similar sound. Damping, the way the wood rings when it's tapped, ought to have some bearing as well, but so far as I've been able to tell, density seems to be more important. It's possible that damping sets a limit to what you can get, but doesn't help if you mess up and make the guitar wrong. It's distressingly easy to make a bad guitar from good wood. OTOH, a really good maker can make a good guitar out of any excuse for wood. It might be possible to get a 'rosewood' sort of sound from mahogany, particularly if it's on the dense side, but in general if you want the sound of rosewood it's easier to get if you start off with something that's like a rosewood.

You keep on trying Alan. My hat’s off to you for persistence

[stringjunky]

Originally Posted by Haasome

You keep on trying Alan. My hat’s off to you for persistence

He's a proper trooper... when the going gets tough....

[IndyHD28]

A luthier once taught me to check Janka Hardness to rate body wood performance and this has generally held up well IME. I instantly respect anyone who properly uses the word “damping” instead of a similar word that connotes wetting.

[gitarro]

I have played 4 guitars made by the same luthier. They were made fromm different kinds of spruce and bsck and sides wood and they all sound quite different and even responded differently.

[stringjunky]

Originally Posted by gitarro

I have played 4 guitars made by the same luthier. They were made fromm different kinds of spruce and bsck and sides wood and they all sound quite different and even responded differently.

Lots of variables then.

[TBman]

Originally Posted by palsed

Has anyone noticed even though guitars have different tonewoods, the sound isn't all that different? For example, my GC Taylor Spruce/Koa has a very similar tone to a GC Taylor Cedar/Mahogany. They project differently but the combination of woods result in similar tones, at least to my ears.

Anyone else find that different combos yield similar tones?

I have found that most Taylors are indistinguishable from each other regardless of tone wood. The only two exceptions I've found were a 324 I played a couple of months ago and a maple 600 series that still haunts me from a couple-three years ago.

[vindibona1]

Sure. I'm surprised at how similar my 2010 Taylor 614ce sounds to my 2017 Taylor 814ceDLX; so much so that at times I ask myself why I keep both? I put up a blind test a while back to see if folks could tell which was rosewood and which was maple and 50% guessed wrong and of the other 50% that guessed correctly a number of them had to use the power of deduction to decide. Which one I prefer often comes down to which one has the freshest strings .

[silvereagle48]

Originally Posted by TBman

I have found that most Taylors are indistinguishable from each other regardless of tone wood. The only two exceptions I've found were a 324 I played a couple of months ago and a maple 600 series that still haunts me from a couple-three years ago.

That was my experience after several BTO Taylors.

[zmf]

Originally Posted by TBman

I have found that most Taylors are indistinguishable from each other regardless of tone wood.

+1 The signature sound does seem to come through regardless.

[B Chas]

My experience is cedar & spruce do have a different tone. All the disclaimers in play, you can have a cedar that's spruce like and a spruce that's cedar like.

I have two of the same model, cedar is classic warm compared to the spruce. I love the guitar and I like having the two different sounding examples. Still, it's the builder that has the most influence.

I also have a 90s Taylor (pre NT) that sounds different (better to me) from 21st century Taylors.

[Monsoon1]

Originally Posted by Alan Carruth

To the extent that different woods affect the tone (which may not be much) it's probably a matter of the wood properties. Woods with similar density and Young's modulus (stiffness) tend to produce similar sound. Damping, the way the wood rings when it's tapped, ought to have some bearing as well, but so far as I've been able to tell, density seems to be more important. It's possible that damping sets a limit to what you can get, but doesn't help if you mess up and make the guitar wrong. It's distressingly easy to make a bad guitar from good wood. OTOH, a really good maker can make a good guitar out of any excuse for wood. It might be possible to get a 'rosewood' sort of sound from mahogany, particularly if it's on the dense side, but in general if you want the sound of rosewood it's easier to get if you start off with something that's like a rosewood.

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