Hollow Bodies, Jazzboxes, Rockabilly Guitars, etc.

[Puddleglum]

https://www.epiphone.com/en-US/Elect...ntique-Natural

I recently stumbled across this model. Looks very nice! Anyone here ever played one?

[Steve DeRosa]

(Deleted)...

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Puddleglum

https://www.epiphone.com/en-US/Elect...ntique-Natural

I recently stumbled across this model. Looks very nice! Anyone here ever played one?

The 150th Anniversary Epiphone Zephyr Deluxe Regent was, according to a long-standing rumor dating to the hasty discontinuation of the ill-conceived Masterbilt archtops of the 2010's, intended to be part of a series of historically-accurate reproductions of iconic New York and early Kalamazoo models (FYI the acoustics were to be all carved-tops in the New York tradition, and priced to compete with Loar and Eastman in the entry-level/intermediate jazzbox market) and, as the sole survivor of the stillborn line, it's a fairly decent rendition of a well-maintained/mildly-modified (the original had a Frequensator tailpiece and the controls differed somewhat) circa-1953 New York example. I've read some good things about the other instruments in Epiphone's current "new-stalgia" lineup of vintage-style guitars, and I see no reason the big box should be any different...

On the other hand, Sweetwater is having a blowout sale on in-stock Made in Korea Guild Newark St. hollowbodies - $849-949 brand-new w/OHSC (even cheaper for demos):



https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...vibrato-blonde



https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...ar-canyon-dusk
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...tar-gold-coast



https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...al-malibu-blue
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...ar-scarlet-red

Comparable to upper-midrange Ibanez build quality, with a hefty helping of Gretsch tonal/cosmetic mojo on the DeArmond Dynasonic X-175's - well worth a look, since you missed out on the last of the MIK Gretsch 5400-Series E-Matics a couple years back...

[FizicalGrafity]

I've always thought it would be cool to get a gnarly, cheap Japanese made sunburst hollowbody off reverb and do a lot of work on it. Would save you $1k or more and be unique.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by FizicalGrafity

I've always thought it would be cool to get a gnarly, cheap Japanese-made sunburst hollowbody off Reverb and do a lot of work on it. Would save you $1k or more and be unique.

Don't know if you were around back in the early-60's, when the first Japanese import electrics came to America and were being sold as novelties in the Times Square tourist/curio shops for $29 - FYI I was - and although they presently have a cult following for their snarky tone they were trainwrecks even brand-new, and IME even more so now with 60 years of aging under their belts...

IME if you're into restoring entry-level guitars from that era you'd be better-served seeking out a period Harmony or Kay (possibly even an entry-level Gretsch or Guild thinline, like the Clipper or "Slim Jim"): better construction overall, nicer (in many cases) finishes, better electronics (the "Kleenex" pickups - rumored to have been made by Gibson and based on a P-90 but with different magnets and/or winding - are highly prized among knowledgeable players), and still relatively easy to find at yard/garage/estate sales (got my '61 Kay Galaxie at a church rummage sale for $20 w/period SSC - $200 to my tech for restoration to a playable state when I get the chance, and I can flip it for $650-850 when I grow tired of it)...

[Puddleglum]

I was recently in my local GC and they had a vintage 60s Harmony thin hollowbody on the wall for $699. I’d not have given them $10 for it. It was not a good instrument. More of a wall-hanger than a serious guitar.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Puddleglum

I was recently in my local GC and they had a vintage 60s Harmony thin hollowbody on the wall for $699. I’d not have given them $10 for it. It was not a good instrument. More of a wall-hanger than a serious guitar.

As beginner/intermediate guitars they took some heavy abuse back in the day - Harmony archtops and electrics (the various Rocket iterations and Meteor in particular) were the standard fare at the neighborhood music school where I took lessons, and as the former owner of a non-trussrod Broadway I can vouch for this state of affairs (which included the ravages of the old bridge-cable Black Diamond strings) - but IME there are still a few under-the-bed gems to be had if you're patient and, as in my own case, some restorable special-interest pieces that are worth investing in for the purpose of resale at profit...

[FizicalGrafity]

Originally Posted by Steve DeRosa

Don't know if you were around back in the early-60's, when the first Japanese import electrics came to America and were being sold as novelties in the Times Square tourist/curio shops for $29 - FYI I was - and although they presently have a cult following for their snarky tone they were trainwrecks even brand-new, and IME even more so now with 60 years of aging under their belts...

IME if you're into restoring entry-level guitars from that era you'd be better-served seeking out a period Harmony or Kay (possibly even an entry-level Gretsch or Guild thinline, like the Clipper or "Slim Jim"): better construction overall, nicer (in many cases) finishes, better electronics (the "Kleenex" pickups - rumored to have been made by Gibson and based on a P-90 but with different magnets and/or winding - are highly prized among knowledgeable players), and still relatively easy to find at yard/garage/estate sales (got my '61 Kay Galaxie at a church rummage sale for $20 w/period SSC - $200 to my tech for restoration to a playable state when I get the chance, and I can flip it for $650-850 when I grow tired of it)...

I guess my experience is different. I've had kays and harmonies back when Jack White was driving up prices. They were more like unplayable toys to me. Maybe it was just the models I had. I wasn't around during the 60s, unfortunately; I was born in the early 80s. I had a tiesco del ray that was decent. Gretsch guitars are really cool and affordable. Anyway, maybe Kays had better tone woods to begin with which isn't a bad suggestion if hot-rodding. And they look cool.

Although if I were looking for a new guitar with a $2k budget, I'd be looking at 1950's Gibson L48s or similar. There's a nice one locally and they are asking $1,800.

[FizicalGrafity]

Originally Posted by Puddleglum

I was recently in my local GC and they had a vintage 60s Harmony thin hollowbody on the wall for $699. I’d not have given them $10 for it. It was not a good instrument. More of a wall-hanger than a serious guitar.

My experience also.

[fazool]

Hollow body (aka Jazz) guitars are my greatest disappointment.

I think they are the most beautiful guitars and I love the idea of them, especially ones with acoustic bridges like Taylor T5's and Michael Kelly hybrids.

They are wonderfully comfortable to play.

Every time I have one I can't stand the sound. I can never get an acceptable acoustic tone nor a usable electric tone.

I love those guitars.....i Just hate how they sound

[rollypolly]

Any opinions on the Yamaha SA "super axe" models like SA-700 , SA-1100, etc. ?

[Russ C]

Originally Posted by fazool

Hollow body (aka Jazz) guitars are my greatest disappointment.

I think they are the most beautiful guitars and I love the idea of them, especially ones with acoustic bridges like Taylor T5's and Michael Kelly hybrids.

They are wonderfully comfortable to play.

Every time I have one I can't stand the sound. I can never get an acceptable acoustic tone nor a usable electric tone.

I love those guitars.....i Just hate how they sound

I empathise. I think the electric sounds we have come to accept and like are not helped by a hollow body - especially at volume. It’s not just a feedback thing but the “smoothness” and sustain from a solid instrument just sit better in the complexity of a band’s sound (unless it’s a jazz band of some sort where that tone is expected) .. and particularly if distortion is part of it.
I often prefer my 330 (which is not very acoustic) at home but my Les Paul with similar pickups gets the band gigs every time.
An L5 has been a life long desire for me but as beautiful to have and to hold and look at as they are I don’t see myself owning one anymore.
I think amplifying the acoustic qualities of a hollow electric is an art that can be rewarding but it ain’t easy.

[dilver]

When I was just starting to play guitar, I used to get Guitar Player magazine. One issue featured The John Entwistle Collection - bass player from The Who had amassed quite the collection of vintage guitars - and on the front cover was a Gretsch 6120. I remember looking at that big orange Gretsch and thinking “wow, you must have to be really good to play a guitar like that”.

Years later, I became obsessed with these big orange guitars. Studied everything I could about Gretsch and 6120s and came to understand that the recent professional line Gretsch came out of two factories in Japan and that the quality was outstanding. I had to have one. Found one at a small music store in Ohio that was on consignment from the family of the former owner who had passed. I bought it and proceeded to learn how to properly set up a Bigsby so it doesn’t go out of tune.

Naturally, I thought of rockabilly music and spent hours learning Travis picking, watching You Tube videos and listening to lots of Carl Perkins, Brian Setzer, Buzz Campbell, Rev Horton Heat, Paul Pigat, Hillbilly Hellcats. Learned a lot and got to be good but not great at rockabilly. Got lots of Gretsch guitars. Eventually, I lost interest in rockabilly and sold all but one Gretsch guitar… the original orange 6120 that started it all. These guitars can do more than rockabilly - most of Whos’s Next is Townshend using his 6120 - and playing with the Bigsby and the controlled feedback when using a slightly overdriven tube amp is addicting. Go Gretsch. Just get a proper Pro line model and some TV Jones pickups. Check out Gretsch-talk.com. Lots of info and good people.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by fazool

Hollow body (aka Jazz) guitars are my greatest disappointment...
Every time I have one I can't stand the sound. I can never get an acceptable acoustic tone nor a usable electric tone...

Originally Posted by Russ C

I empathize. I think the electric sounds we have come to accept and like are not helped by a hollow body - especially at volume. It’s not just a feedback thing but the “smoothness” and sustain from a solid instrument just sit better in the complexity of a band’s sound (unless it’s a jazz band of some sort where that tone is expected) .. and particularly if distortion is part of it...

For anyone who is used to the relatively uniform response and sustain of solidbody guitars, hollowbody electrics can indeed be a disappointment - or a reality check on one's technical skills, much as their acoustic counterparts are for someone who's used to the lush sustain and technically forgiving nature of a flattop guitar; the flip side of the coin is the richness of tone a good electric jazzbox can produce, and the broader dynamic potential for a player with good pick control - provided, of course, one has the clean right- and left-hand technique to fully utilize its inherent capabilities. If you're a speed-picker or advanced rhythm player dealing in complex patterns - and not just in the jazz milieu - you're not going to get the same note-to-note separation or defined initial attack from a typical solidbody; in addition, the dynamic range allows for rapid changes from solo to rhythm without riding the volume knob (or, in more recent times, kicking in a boost pedal) - a handy state of affairs in the early days of electric guitar amplification (when 15 watts was considered high power for a guitar amp), and/or there was major potential for early-onset feedback in the close quarters of a postwar local jazz club. Finally, many early soul/blues/R&B bands used hollowbody guitars for most of the reasons above - which contributed to rather than detracted from their ability to sit well in a mix - and I'll be using one of my own deep-body jazzboxes for an upcoming program of first-decade R&R at the local senior center for much the same reasons...

Originally Posted by dilver

...Go Gretsch. Just get a proper Pro Line model and some TV Jones pickups...

While I'll agree 100% about the Professional Series instruments' uncanny quality - I've got a 2013 G6136DC double-cut White Falcon myself - the post-2013 Korean-made 5400/5600-Series Electromatics are head-shoulders-&-navel above anything else in their extremely reasonable (well under $1K new) price range, leaving little if anything on the table in terms of QC/fit-&-finish (and nothing in tone/playability) vis-a-vis their upline stablemates, main (and relatively minor) differences being hardware and pickups. If you're a Gretsch fan and you've never played one, you owe it to yourself to do so: just make sure your credit card isn't maxed out, since - as many of your fellow AGF'ers here on the Electric subforum will attest - those who try them inevitably buy them...

[Puddleglum]

Originally Posted by dilver

When I was just starting to play guitar, I used to get Guitar Player magazine. One issue featured The John Entwistle Collection - bass player from The Who had amassed quite the collection of vintage guitars - and on the front cover was a Gretsch 6120. I remember looking at that big orange Gretsch and thinking “wow, you must have to be really good to play a guitar like that”.

Years later, I became obsessed with these big orange guitars. Studied everything I could about Gretsch and 6120s and came to understand that the recent professional line Gretsch came out of two factories in Japan and that the quality was outstanding. I had to have one. Found one at a small music store in Ohio that was on consignment from the family of the former owner who had passed. I bought it and proceeded to learn how to properly set up a Bigsby so it doesn’t go out of tune.

Naturally, I thought of rockabilly music and spent hours learning Travis picking, watching You Tube videos and listening to lots of Carl Perkins, Brian Setzer, Buzz Campbell, Rev Horton Heat, Paul Pigat, Hillbilly Hellcats. Learned a lot and got to be good but not great at rockabilly. Got lots of Gretsch guitars. Eventually, I lost interest in rockabilly and sold all but one Gretsch guitar… the original orange 6120 that started it all. These guitars can do more than rockabilly - most of Whos’s Next is Townshend using his 6120 - and playing with the Bigsby and the controlled feedback when using a slightly overdriven tube amp is addicting. Go Gretsch. Just get a proper Pro line model and some TV Jones pickups. Check out Gretsch-talk.com. Lots of info and good people.

Wow, i love the purple one!