Fifteen months in and advice

[owen006]

I am 45 and have been learning guitar for about 15 months. I have really enjoyed the journey so far and am getting to the point where new things come a little easier. I have most of the open cords (major and minor) down pretty well and can practice a simpler song for a couple of weeks and make it sound pretty good. Would not describe my self as having any musical talent, but I am doggedly persistent.

My problem is, and I imagine I know the answer, consistence. For example, a quick change from G to C, does not consistently go well. My C fingering will mute surrounding strings. I believe one of my issues is I try to press harder than necessary on the fretting. It seems when I practice one minute changes, via Justinguitar, I don’t fret as hard and do better. I am using the tips of my fingers, it seems to me more exact finger placement with less pressure is necessary. I imagine the answer is time and practice, but do you all have any recommendations?

[Dru Edwards]

Hi Owen. I like how you said you were "doggedly persistent", that alone will help a great deal. Have you looked into guitars with different nut widths? What's the nut width you are playing now?

Also, have you had an experience player/teacher look at your technique to ensure that it is correct?

[martind42]

Originally Posted by owen006

For example, a quick change from G to C, does not consistently go well. My C fingering will mute surrounding strings.

If you are playing your G the Mel Bay way, I might suggest an option. Play the G using your pinky finger to play the high E, first string, the ring finger to play the low E, the sixth string and your middle finger to play the A, fifth string.

I have found that makes for a much quicker chord change from G to C than any other combination. Give it a try.

[owen006]

Thanks for the responses:

martind42: I am playing with 2,3,4 using my pinky on the high E and can see how this is the quickest way to transition from G to C.

Dru Edwards: The guitar I play the most is 1 11/16 nut. I do have an old Harmony Sovereign that has a wider nut and I can make better transitions between cords on it. I don't have large hands or fingers but do feel that with the wider nut there is some wiggle room. The problem with the Harmony is that it doesn't play as smoothly. I believe that because of the wider string spacing at the saddle, I can not make strumming sound as good.

I have played with a couple of people who say my technique looks good. But, they could just not want to risk offending me. I will have some extra time this summer and believe I will get with an instructor.

[Oldguy64]

I play a "cowboy" G most of the time with my pinky on the high e and my ring finger on the B. Then it's an easy transition to C2.
Look at the tablature for Wanted Dead or Alive by Bon Jovi to see the exact fingering.

[Wasabi65]

Originally Posted by owen006

I have played with a couple of people who say my technique looks good. But, they could just not want to risk offending me. I will have some extra time this summer and believe I will get with an instructor.

This WILL help!
A good instructor would be constructive but wont mind offending you

[devellis]

It just takes time. It sounds like you're running into the frustrations that everyone has at a certain point. Believe me, persist and the problems will pass.

One thing that can help is to determine exactly why strings are being dampened. I've been playing a while and I still have that problem sometimes and it's really obvious when you're fingerpicking. I try to locate the actual offending finger and determine why it's not doing its job the way it should. Sometimes I'll realize that one finger is creeping over the top of the fret a bit and muting the string that way or another is hitting an adjacent string because it isn't meeting the fingerboard straight down but at too much of an angle. In any case, being aware of what's wrong is helpful to me. I'll really concentrate on improving my finger position. Although it usually doesn't improve things that much then and there, I'll often find that the next time I play, I;m noting those strings more cleanly.

In the beginning, it isn't unusual for more than one finger to be a source of the problem but it may be best to isolate each individual problem on its own at first. Sometimes, just shifting the hand a bit will clear up multiple problems but if that doesn't work and each offending finger requires some individual concentration, it may be best to focus on each one separately.

And when you think you've cured a problem it will recur (especially if you're tired). Don't sweat it. Fixing it the second time is usually easier than it was the first time. Everyone goes through this stuff and it's just a matter of applying the fixes until they become second nature. By the way, it's pretty cool when you realize that something that was a constant irritant has finally become a complete non-issue. And it will happen if you persist.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by owen006

…one of my issues is I try to press harder than necessary on the fretting. It seems when I practice one minute changes, via Justinguitar, I don’t fret as hard and do better. I am using the tips of my fingers, it seems to me more exact finger placement with less pressure is necessary. I imagine the answer is time and practice, but do you all have any recommendations?

Hi owen...

A key to good flow is learning to play relaxed rather than forcing yourself through musical passages. When you do the drills, you are learning to anticipate the change and then accomplish it in a relaxed, yet timely, fashion.

Your analysis of more exact placement with less pressure is correct. An exercise for learning to control chords is to play the same chord in 4/4 time in staccato fashion on beats 1 and 2 and then play it a third time and let it sustain through beats 3 and 4 (short-rest short-rest long). Don't allow any volume differences or fingering differences between the ⅛ notes and the half note.

This is an exercise I use with students to learn to maintain control of string pressure no matter how long the resulting chord lasts. Once you master this exercise in relaxed fashion, you can make chords all loud, or all soft, or mix the volumes up, but the finger pressure will remain the same.

[Drubbing]

It's time, practice and muscle memory. If you're fudging it, pressing harder ail only be counter productive, you need to stay relaxed. I remember missing CG changes, 2 years in, I can do any open chords sure and smooth (most of the time) without looking. That's muscle memory, you don't even think about forming the chords, you just go there.

Wait til you tackle the F chord, you'll need that persistence then. I think it was a good 8 months til I started to get comfortable with it, and even now I can still make it sloppy occasionally.

[Jim Owen]

Hi Owen,
Lots of good advice here--Bob Devalis' analysis is spot on. It's akin to watching tapes of a pitcher's delivery to sort out any quirks. Just finding what the issue is, isolating it, and being mindful will work wonders over time.

I offer one more suggestion. Play with others. I cannot overstate how much your skills will evolve if you find others to play with. You'll make mistakes, of course. But so do I, and I've played for years.

[magazine]

It takes time, as long as your enjoying yourself, thats all that matters. You WILL get there. It does take a while though. Make sure your action is about a tenth of an inch on the big E string at the 12th fret though. My guitar not being set up was one reason I couldnt do barre chords earlier. It took buying a Taylor before I understood the concept.

[mattyfez]

Switching from anything to open F Is where I struggle, I normally cheat a bit and do a partial F heheh.

Going from G to C, I've never struggled with, but I do have another short cut, which sometime sounds better, depending on the song, when playing a G, you can leave your pinkie and/or 3rd fingers where they are on the high E string and B string and then just drop your first two fingers down a string each... It's works quite well as long as you dint need to emphisise the treble strings too much and damp the low/bass E string with your thumb.

[Drubbing]

Playing with others can help a lot. But you need people who appreciate where you're at and who will run with that.

I jammed with one other guy - he's got 30 years playing on me and we blasted through some simple songs. I stopped trying to get perfect and played through the mistakes, which his playing mostly covered up. If I fell off rhythm, he'd let me get back in, or we'd start back where I fell and we'd get back into it. It's wasn't an exercise in ignoring mistakes, but learning to get finish stuff.

Contrast with playing with a full band plugged in, where i'd tried to learn some of the tunes they were playing beforehand, and they were doable at my pace, but I just couldn't keep up with them, and ended up feeling like a doofus standing there, with things moving too fast for me to jump in. THey were nice and want me to go back, but it was a confidence sapping experience, and not constructive at all.

[MBE]

You sound determined to improve, and clearly have the insight into things that are going wrong. The key is to persist with working to improve the errors you are making. Ljguitar gave you some good practice tips. Something else I'd recommend is practicing using the absolutely minimum force required.

Here's what I mean. Play a chord - your choice. Let's say, G. Strum it how you would normally play it and let the notes ring out. Now strum it again, and again, releasing the tiniest bit of pressure with your fretting hand each time. Repeat until you reach the point of the fretted notes no longer ringing out clearly, then move one step back in the other direction (adding back a minute amount of pressure) so that they ring out cleanly again.

You have now identified how much unnecessary force you've been using. Almost everyone presses harder than they need to. This exercise helps you identify your personal level of "overkill" and helps you to learn what it feels like to press "just enough".

Another good exercise is to try fretting without your thumb touching the back of the neck. That one teaches you how virtually all the force for fretting comes from the fingers, not a vice grip with the thumb. The thumb is just there as a counterweight and stabilizer.

[MikeBmusic]

15 months - just keep on practicing/playing. It may seem like a long time, but its a more-gradual learning curve than you would imagine.