Odd Sounding Note Is Baffling Me

[Big-Al]

I’ve been puzzling over an odd sounding note on a particular guitar. It is the D# located on the 4th fret of the second string. It sounds odd to me, kind of twangy or metallic compared to notes around it. If I’m picking or strumming something that contains that note, that particular note stands out in a bad way.

It doesn’t appear to be a fret issue. The frets are in good shape and there aren’t any high or loose frets. (I checked several times.) The saddle height and neck relief are just about optimal.

Changing the string from .016” to .015” diameter doesn’t help. Changing string brands doesn’t help.

If I tune the string up or down a half-step, the problem does not move to a different fret. The problem simply goes away.

If I play over the soundhole, the problem stands out. If I play closer to the neck or the bridge, the note sounds fairly normal.

Ideas anyone?

[devellis]

Really sounds like a high 5th fret to me, although apparently you've already ruled that out. Or, a groove in the 4th fret under that string that allows the string to buzz against the 5th fret. But again, you've said the frets are good. I can see why you're puzzled.

[Big-Al]

Originally Posted by devellis

Really sounds like a high 5th fret to me, although apparently you've already ruled that out. Or, a groove in the 4th fret under that string that allows the string to buzz against the 5th fret. But again, you've said the frets are good. I can see why you're puzzled.

Frets are crowned well and show no wear. I've been up and down the neck with a fret rocker, strings on and off, neck dead flat. I did find a couple of slightly high frets further up the neck and corrected them. No change. If the 5th fret was high, tuning the guitar down a half-step should make the problem worse. It doesn't. The problem goes away. Strange.

[StrumFu]

More than likely 5th fret is just ever so slightly high where that string is. Other than that, could be that particular frequency is triggering some other thing to buzz. Which could be why it goes away if you tune up or down. Try touching different areas (other strings, bridge, areas of the guitar top, the strings above the nut, etc...) while making the note that buzzes. See if anything makes it stop.

[Rodger Knox]

The 5th fret is a little high at the second string would be my first guess.

It doesn't make sense to me that changing string size (and obviously tension) does nothing, but tuning up OR down eliminates the problem. Is that really what you meant?

It does make sense that picking over the soundhole is the worst, the maximum excursion of the string would be close to the 5th fret, and moving either direction would also move the maximum excursion.

Put a small piece of tape under the 2nd string on the 5th fret and see if that makes it worse, or changes the sound. If it doesn't, it could be the 6th or 7th fret, which could mean that the 4th fret is a little LOW.

[Von Beerhofen]

The onset of a pick onto the string can generate an unwanted harmonic which can be slightly off pitch to the played note. From the soundhole towards the saddle are many of such harmonics very close together.
If this is what's causing the twangy sound just move your pick hand to another position. A softer more flexible pick can help too, for this reason I love nylons.

Ludwig

[dhalbert]

What about the same note played on other strings? Do you get the problem then?

[justonwo]

Sometimes you can get weird sympathetic vibrations that have nothing to do at all with the note you fretting - it's just that a particular note sets off the resonant frequency in some other part of the guitar. Put a capo on the trouble fret and then start damping things all over the guitar with your fingertips to find the culprit. It can sometimes be other strings buzzing on high frets or a variety of other issues. I once had a tiny gap between the heel cap and body of the guitar. It was less than 0.001", but certain notes made the heel cap buzz against the body like a saw. It sounded horrible and took me forever to track down.

Anyway, fret that note and then start damping everything you can think of on the guitar. You'll eventually find the culprit.

[Guitar1083]

Originally Posted by Big-Al

I’ve been puzzling over an odd sounding note on a particular guitar. It is the D# located on the 4th fret of the second string. It sounds odd to me, kind of twangy or metallic compared to notes around it. If I’m picking or strumming something that contains that note, that particular note stands out in a bad way.

Tune that note D# perfect.

[Bear Davis]

Take it to a luthier?

[Big-Al]

Thanks for all the responses.

Well . . . I re-checked the fret heights and they are all good. I tried adding some neck relief to increase the string clearance above the frets. I tried putting tape over various frets. I checked for loose or oddly vibrating parts. I even switched out the bone saddle to Tusq.

The problem still remains. In standard tuning, one note sounds odd to me on the B string, 4th fret. The same note sounds fine when played on a different string or on the 2nd string when it's tuned to a different note. Tuning the 2nd string to Bb or C makes all the notes sound ok.

I've tried to demonstrate it to my lovely bride, but she claims she doesn't hear anything odd about that note. I'm coming to the conclusion that the problem is me. Some harmonic of that note must be interacting with my tinnitus . . . as the ringing in my ears is about the same pitch as the odd sound I'm hearing from the guitar. Gettin' old isn't much fun . . . sigh . . . .

I'm hearing it on other guitars too. If I modify my right hand position or switch to a heavy pick, I can make the problem less noticeable. That's my solution for now.

[Guitar1083]

Originally Posted by Big-Al

Thanks for all the responses.

Well . . . I re-checked the fret heights and they are all good. I tried adding some neck relief to increase the string clearance above the frets. I tried putting tape over various frets. I checked for loose or oddly vibrating parts. I even switched out the bone saddle to Tusq.

The problem still remains. In standard tuning, one note sounds odd to me on the B string, 4th fret. The same note sounds fine when played on a different string or on the 2nd string when it's tuned to a different note. Tuning the 2nd string to Bb or C makes all the notes sound ok.

I've tried to demonstrate it to my lovely bride, but she claims she doesn't hear anything odd about that note. I'm coming to the conclusion that the problem is me. Some harmonic of that note must be interacting with my tinnitus . . . as the ringing in my ears is about the same pitch as the odd sound I'm hearing from the guitar. Gettin' old isn't much fun . . . sigh . . . .

I'm hearing it on other guitars too. If I modify my right hand position or switch to a heavy pick, I can make the problem less noticeable. That's my solution for now.

Why dont you just start tuning to 432hz, I do.

[Big-Al]

Originally Posted by Guitar1083

Why dont you just start tuning to 432hz, I do.

Hmmm . . . might clash with the piano at 440 . . .

[Guitar1083]

Originally Posted by Big-Al

Hmmm . . . might clash with the piano at 440 . . .

Piano Piano or keyboard

[rampix]

You mention that it goes away if you tune down 1/2 step. How about if you tune there and use a capo on the first fret to play along with the piano in 440?

I had a wolf note on 2 strings on my J45 that I finally tracked down to ill fitting bridge pins. I slotted the bridge and installed solid bridge pins. The wolf notes totally disappeared.