NFL Mushroom Helmets?

[fazool]

Originally Posted by LAPlayer

One would assume you know, but I will state the obvious in case someone doesn't, that is for practice only. That's not a helmet, it's a helmet with a protective cover.

One would assume you know, but I will state the obvious in case someone doesn't, Mark Kelso wore his in every subsequent NFL game. It added a cushioning layer - it was (I think) essentially first developed and tried for him.

[fazool]

Originally Posted by Golffishny

The helmet is not the problem. The brain still bangs against the skull. Until they can inject foam between the skull and brain the damage will continue.

The foam cushioning slows the deceleration by damping, like a shock absorber which, in turn, slows the deceleration and whack of the brain against the skull.

[LAPlayer]

Originally Posted by fazool

One would assume you know, but I will state the obvious in case someone doesn't, Mark Kelso wore his in every subsequent NFL game. It added a cushioning layer - it was (I think) essentially first developed and tried for him.

Yes. Thanks, that's been mentioned. If that were an actual solution to the problem, they would probably be using some variant of that today. As has been mentioned, hitting the head isn't the primary issue, it's the rapid-deceleration of the brain hitting the inside of the skull. I would venture that no one on the forum has the solution, since one hasn't been found yet. I could write a song about it but, I think that would fall short of a solution.

[raysachs]

The rule changes to strongly discourage players from using their heads (or target other players heads) in tackling is probably the only thing that’s gonna help much. But given the speed of the game, it’s often very hard to avoid violent collisions involving the head. I remember playing at a MUCH slower speed and with much smaller players in high school and how little control we ultimately had as to HOW we were gonna hit someone. We were mostly concerned that we WOULD hit him and bring him down. I had at least a few concussions (probably several - they were never diagnosed and I never came out of a game for more than a few plays) my junior year and it really affected me. I remember when the season was over knowing that my head was not right and wondering if I was ever gonna feel like myself again. After a few months, I was OK and quite relieved about it and I didn’t play my senior year.

Football is inherently a brutal sport that I believes does more harm than good to our society and definitely for a lot of the people who play it. I believe it ought to be banned, but it won’t happen in my lifetime, if ever. I’m an addict - I’ve tried to stop watching it and have never come close to succeeding. So I’ll probably keep watching as long as they roll it out each Fall - it’s just been so much a part of my life that I can’t seem to quit it. But I have a grandson I hope never plays - his Dad was a soccer player so I think there’s a good chance his parents will steer him toward safer sports if he’s interested in sports. I hope so…

-Ray

[Glennwillow]

I have known a few professional football players. They all died young. They were proud of their football history, but the game beat them up very badly.

In my older years I have found myself grateful to my father for not allowing us to play football. And I loved playing touch football as a kid.

- Glenn

[Wade Hampton]

My father told me at age five that he would never let me play tackle football. He knew too many guys who’d been permanently messed up playing high school ball.

I played flag football in a YMCA league in my later elementary school years, and that was fun, but with my slender build no high school football coach tried to recruit me. Dad wouldn’t have let me play even if they had.

Wade Hampton Miller

[fazool]

Originally Posted by raysachs

The rule changes to strongly discourage players from using their heads (or target other players heads) in tackling is probably the only thing that’s gonna help much. ...

along those lines:

If you watch high school sports - lacrosse is a brutally physical sport, effectively with swinging cudgels.

Girls lacrosse does not allow for any protective gear except eyeguard and mouth guard. In cold weather, girls arent even allowed to wear cotton gloves the keep their hands warm. The rational is that it gives them an advantage and protection. They have a similar rule against helmets: if one girl wore a helmet she could bash into other people causing harm, so its everyone or no one.

They have, however, recently started allowing soft helmets so the girls head is protected but they cant hurt someone with it

[Slothead56]

Originally Posted by fazool

along those lines:

If you watch high school sports - lacrosse is a brutally physical sport, effectively with swinging cudgels.

My youngest son started playing lacrosse at 6 or 7 years old and played D1 in college.

Physical? Absolutely. Brutal? Maybe not. I’ve watched hundreds of games at all levels and only recall seeing someone taken off the field once for a shot to the groin (he wasn’t wearing a cup). Injuries? Sure. My son’s arms would be black and blue all season from his glove line to his elbow pads. But you couldn’t pry that stick out of his hand.

He’s five or six years post college and now coaches on the West Coast.

Having said that I was more than happy when he quit football in eighth grade. to focus on lax year round.

[RussL30]

I'm a high school football coach. We use these guardian caps during spring practice and fall camp. They have cut down on head injuries during practice. They have a place but I don't know if I'm crazy about them being worn during games.

This may fall under the list of concessions that have to be made to keep this great game alive for future generations.

[Dogma]

There is a very interesting and sobering Frontline episode, a number of years old now, about CTE and its causes and effects. Of the many findings presented (and there is likely more known now), the one that stuck with me most was the case of a high school football player who died (might have been suicide, I can't remember now) and subsequent post-mortem analysis showed the beginnings of CTE even at his young age.

I have a daughter so was not faced with the issue, but my very sports oriented neighbors, with two sons currently in high school sports, won't let them play football either. Glenn and Wade had parents with a lot of foresight.

[RussL30]

Originally Posted by raysachs

Football is inherently a brutal sport that I believes does more harm than good to our society and definitely for a lot of the people who play it. I believe it ought to be banned, but it won’t happen in my lifetime, if ever. I’m an addict - I’ve tried to stop watching it and have never come close to succeeding. So I’ll probably keep watching as long as they roll it out each Fall - it’s just been so much a part of my life that I can’t seem to quit it. But I have a grandson I hope never plays - his Dad was a soccer player so I think there’s a good chance his parents will steer him toward safer sports if he’s interested in sports. I hope so…

-Ray

Football does more harm than good? I 100% diaagree with you.

Nothing has taught me more about life, fighting through adversity and not giving up and mental and physical toughness than playing football did. So many valuable life lessons to be learned that prepares kids for the real world.

I've coached high school for a long time now, and most people would be shocked at the number of kids who only stay motivated in school because of they want to play football. We hold our kids accountable in the classroom and make grades and academic success a priority.

If football was banned, it would reflect very negatively on our society as a whole. There's so much more I want to say on that topic, but it might violate forum rules so I will refrain.


I hate to see all the negativity here towards football and kids playing. I do not agree with starting too early. I probably won't let my sons start until they are 12. I also won't make them play but they can if they choose too. Kids get hurt in many other sports as well. Soccer and cheerleading statistically have a higher concussion rate than football.

[seannx]

How hard would it be to fit helmets with accelerometers?

[dnf777]

Originally Posted by Jamolay

But the ones that did happen would be much more horrific and the accumulated smaller ones would also be much worse.

Not true. There is no need whatsoever for the hard shell on helmets. It contributes nothing to reducing decelerations. You are not deflecting projectiles or shielding abrasion. (ie bike helmet). Leather, canvas, or NO helmet would reduce concussion, spine, and CTE injury. Look at rugby.

[raysachs]

Originally Posted by RussL30

Football does more harm than good? I 100% diaagree with you.

Nothing has taught me more about life, fighting through adversity and not giving up and mental and physical toughness than playing football did. So many valuable life lessons to be learned that prepares kids for the real world.

I've coached high school for a long time now, and most people would be shocked at the number of kids who only stay motivated in school because of they want to play football. We hold our kids accountable in the classroom and make grades and academic success a priority.

If football was banned, it would reflect very negatively on our society as a whole. There's so much more I want to say on that topic, but it might violate forum rules so I will refrain.

I hate to see all the negativity here towards football and kids playing. I do not agree with starting too early. I probably won't let my sons start until they are 12. I also won't make them play but they can if they choose too. Kids get hurt in many other sports as well. Soccer and cheerleading statistically have a higher concussion rate than football.

You're a football coach. I figured you'd disagree with me and you SHOULD disagree with me. But I firmly believe that the things you point to as the positives you see with kids playing football (which I agree with) could be achieved with lots of other less harmful sports, like soccer, basketball, lacrosse, baseball, etc. It's possible to be injured, even seriously, even with head injuries, in those sports too, but but they're incidental to those sports and it's almost a design feature of football. People love it because of the violence - I enjoy seeing a good hit as much as anyone, but I know the damage they can do. I don't think the harm inherent in football can be eliminated or even seriously reduced. I appreciate all that's being done to try to lessen the inevitable damage that football does to the human brain (and other body parts) but I think there are real limits to how much good they can do.

It won't change anytime soon, not in my lifetime, maybe it never will. I get how ingrained football is in our society - I love the freaking game despite my serious misgivings about it. I learned some important lessons from it about pushing myself beyond what I saw as my own limits. But, as I said above, I believe those same positives can be gained from other sports (and could have for me - I re-learned a lot of those same lessons again as an adult as a hard core cyclist for many years) just as well without the inherent violence and potential damage that football inflicts on so many.

I'll never stop being a fan. But as I noted, I view it as more of an addiction than anything, because I see it as fundamentally harmful - if I had the courage of my convictions, I'd stop watching and not support it in any way. But I've tried and failed, I can't stop - I've been watching football on Autumn weekends since I was four years old (if not earlier, but that's when I first remember) and I'll clearly keep doing it. And I'll analyze the game and behave like any other idiot fan during the season because that's what I am. But I'm glad I had daughters so I didn't have to face decisions about whether to let them play football or not (or circumcision!), and I hope my one grandson takes up almost any other sport. His Dad was/is a surfer, skateboarder, and is a soccer fan, so I think he's got a good chance to avoid the gridiron.

-Ray

[Silurian]

Originally Posted by dnf777

Not true. There is no need whatsoever for the hard shell on helmets. It contributes nothing to reducing decelerations. You are not deflecting projectiles or shielding abrasion. (ie bike helmet). Leather, canvas, or NO helmet would reduce concussion, spine, and CTE injury. Look at rugby.

As I mentioned earlier, there is increasing concern about the effects of concussion and other injuries in Rugby.

The approach has been to minimise such injuries through rule changes to minimise head contact with increasing sanctions for (yellow/red cards) tackles that are considered dangerous.

American football and Rugby are different sports, heavy contact sports, yes but still different.

I believe that the off repeated 'look at Rugby, they don't usually wear protection' is misleading and simplistic.