Not crazy about acoustic sound through amp

[xtremekustomz]

I have a taylor with an es1 (I bought an extra k&k to put it it as well) and a taylor with a k&k I installed yesterday. I have my midrange cut on the amp around the 700hz spot and it helps a ton but still sounds muddy. I deal with car audio some and have individual electronic crossovers, levels, phase control and 31 band eq's for each individual speaker. I am pretty picky about sound and have come to really dislike the plugged in sound. What are my options for the acoustic? I don't really play a lot through it so I don't want to spend a ton but is there something out there that will help out? I am heading over to guitar center to see what they have. (I will be there in an hour so let me know what I need to get! lol) I saw the Baggs Para DI mentioned and a friend of mine mentioned a Boss AD-3. I just want a good clear sound that isn't colored.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by xtremekustomz

I have a taylor with an es1 (I bought an extra k&k to put it it as well) and a taylor with a k&k I installed yesterday. I have my midrange cut on the amp around the 700hz spot and it helps a ton but still sounds muddy.

Hi x…

For more detailed and accurate adjustability, I'd recommend an external preamp - specifically a Baggs Venue paired with your K&K. I owned a Boss AD-5 (they now make an AD-8) and it's not that capable. If it were, that's what I'd use with my current rigs. The AD-3 is very scaled back in adjustability features.

If you are extremely picky about tone, and insist on identical non-colored tone which you can be impressed with, a sound which reproduces the tone of your guitar accurately, it doesn't come cheap. It would involve a pricey condenser mic, perhaps an external tube type preamp, and a high end PA or amp. And it still will not be identical to your tone (but it will record very nicely).

You could easily match or exceed the price of your guitar with a system that would mimic your guitar's sound when you play live, which is a large chunk of change to put into something you don't use often. But it would sound great if you can separate the mains from the stage so you don't wrestle with feedback.

They had such a system at Healdsburg the last time round in the guitar demonstration room. Perhaps someone like Doug Young might have noticed the particulars on what mics, mixer, amps, processing gear etc they were using. It was very nice. It was in a 35'X60' room.

Their outdoor stage was not tuned for condenser mics, and attempts to use a condenser out there were certainly a mixed bag (not that there were not multiple attempts at it). Many artists who were acoustically motivated to try and extract better tone with mics ended up either playing at a much lower volume (which is frustrating in an outdoor environment), or mixing the pickup and mic sound to boost their volume so the audience stayed engaged.

But I don't want to throw a lot of bucks at it…
If you accept the fact that a K&K, external preamp, and decent amp/PA will give you a very 'guitar-like' sound which people will never confuse for anything else, and which will reflect your touch, and the guitar's characteristics, you are only an external preamp away (you already have the K&K).

The actual issue is reaching a sound you can live with. It's not a gear problem, but a problem with what we, the artists, will be happy with. The reason I have dual source pickup rigs in all my guitars (K&K Pure mini plus internal mic through an external blender), and carry an acoustic amp is for me, not the audience. They are not as discriminating as I, but I'm the one playing. So I went for a decent tone I can live with.

For what it's worth, I'm not a fan of the ES systems either. They don't sound natural to me. But they work well, and sound techs don't have huge problems getting them to achieve acoustic tone. And when listening to someone play who has one in their guitar, I can switch my critical attitude off and enjoy the music.

[DenverSteve]

Take your guitar with you to GC and see what works better for you. Generally you have to work through trial-and-error to get the exact adjustments you seek for your desired sound. With the K&K make sure all three pickups are firmly attached. If one is not you can lose that frequency range.

[SongwriterFan]

The K&K gives a very nice sound.

But if that's not good enough for you, I recommend trying the LR Baggs Lyric, instead.

[xtremekustomz]

Spent some time in GC today. Tried out the LR Baggs Para DI. I played the 324 with k&k through it and a Loudbox Artist. It sounded pretty good. I then ran the setup through an amp just like mine and it sounded like garbage. I soon found out that my amp just sounds like crap (acoustic ag120s). They had the new model there too (Acoustic A100) and it sounded a lot better than mine. Not sure what they did but it worked! Having found that out I knew to start with I needed a new amp. The Artist had some appearance issues because it had been there on demo. They offered $50 off which wasn't a good deal to me. I called the store down the road and they had a Baggs Venue so I went to check it out. I took my guitars in and the salesman recommended we plug them in directly into an acoustic amp for reference. This is the point where I should have walked out! I mentioned plugging it into the Loudbox Artist they had sitting there but he had another idea and ran it through a Schertler Jam 400. The 324 sounded amazing with the k&k and the 616 with the es1 sounded good but not as good as the 324. I then plugged it into the Artist and it just wasn't the same. So after some negotiations I am the proud owner of a Schertler Jam 400! Sticker price was $1399 + tax and I got them to do out the door tax and all for $1200. On another note I got the k&k in the 616 this evening too. Sounds a lot better than the es1. I didn't want to mess with the es1 by removing parts so I modified the battery pack the accept the 1/4" jack of the mini. That way all I have to do is replace the plastic battery holder.