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  #31  
Old 11-13-2014, 08:58 AM
bjstewa bjstewa is offline
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Originally Posted by Brad13122 View Post
I have bigger hands and fat fingers so I'm wondering would a 1 3/4 nut be better for me. I've just been playing a few months and doing fine but sometimes i feel like an extra 1/8th " of space would help me on some chords. Should I just roll with my 1 11/16th or try out a 1 3/4? Does it really make that much difference? I've noticed most guitars are 1 11/16th now.
I have really big hands. Big palms, wide fingers, but not really what I'd call long fingers.

1-3/4" minimum nut is essential to me. Some people say it doesn't matter. I think those people usually have smaller hand or skinnier fingers than me.

Many people use the term "nut width" because it's an easy spec to reference, but it's really the string spacing that makes the difference. That small difference in spacing is the difference between me inadvertently muting an adjacent string or not. It's still a challenge for me even with 1-3/4" but if you keep going wider there are trade-offs (comfort, being able to reach frets, etc).

You might be able to fine tune your technique and not have it bother you, but 1-11/16" just feels too cramped to me.
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  #32  
Old 11-13-2014, 09:13 AM
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devellis devellis is offline
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Originally Posted by vintageparlors View Post
The profile of the neck has just as must to do with comfort as the nut width. I always encourage my customers to play as many different nut widths and neck profiles they can before their left hand decides on what feels comfortable.
I agree with this. I would also add that the fretboard radius also comes into play. I've pretty much determined that 1 11/16 is too narrow for me but with wider necks, I still like some (with the same nut size) a lot more than others.

To take an extreme example, try curling the fingers of your left hand so that you can position them on your palm in a C-chord shape. Think of this position as corresponding to a neck of zero depth. Now, do the same thing, leaving a space between your fingertips and palm, like there was actually a guitar neck between them. When I do this, I find that at some distances, I just have somewhat greater control and comfort than at others (although I'm actually fine through a pretty wide range). If you imagine that neck as varying in both depth and width as you form your C-chord shape, you may find that you can make the position more comfortable by changing either or both. Of course, what's missing is knowing whether you'd have enough room to fret the strings cleanly without muting the adjacent strings, which is why it's best to try real necks and not rely on this little experiment.

But my point is, nut width -- while important -- is only part of the total comfort and playability equation. So getting your hands on some real guitars is far preferable to assuming that a certain nut width will definitely suit you. Personally, I tend to get my fingers lapping over to adjacent strings more when I play on a very wide, very shallow neck, like most classical guitars have. The strings are obviously farther apart but the geometry of the neck and that of my hand just aren't a great match. Some of this is practice, no doubt, but the "more space" factor doesn't necessarily translate into better finger placement for me.
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  #33  
Old 11-13-2014, 10:25 AM
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Larry Pattis Larry Pattis is offline
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Nut width is just one part of a small-dance that will ultimately relate to playability for an individual, and for their personal preferences. This relates to how the guitar-neck and bridge are built, and the ultimate impact on ergonomics & playability goes far beyond just the one consideration of "nut width".

The list of things to consider is not overly long, but it seems to not have filtered down fully to the guitar playing community:

1) Overall nut width.

2) E-to-E string spacing at the nut, conventionally measured from center-to-center of the E strings.

3) Overall width of the fingerboard at the 12th fret.

4) E-to-E spacing at the bridge.

Beyond this there are things such as scale length, fingerboard radius neck shape, and neck thickness that can also have a significant impact on the "feel" of the guitar.

Some people do not have any problem switching from one set of specifications to another. I am happy for those folks.

Others may indeed find a set of preferred specs that do indeed suit them best...or are at least "better feeling" to them, if one doesn't like to use the word "best".

Good luck with your search...
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Last edited by Glennwillow; 11-13-2014 at 02:20 PM.
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  #34  
Old 11-13-2014, 11:06 AM
DanPanther DanPanther is offline
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Not sure how you can say that. Everyone is different. What is not an issue to you a can be big issue to others. There is no one answer.
It seems to be an issue with most beginners. Once you build callouses, and a bit of technique, I think for the most part you will no longer have an issue with nut width.

Dan
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  #35  
Old 11-13-2014, 11:14 AM
DanPanther DanPanther is offline
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Originally Posted by paulzoom View Post
Could not agree with you more. I think it's an overlooked spec. Learned the hard way when after my first Breedlove (with a 1.75 nut width) I purchased an Eastman online (also a 1.75 nutwidth) and when I got it I was like "hey, this feels cramped, what's going on?" So began my education on string spacing.
Isn't it kind of gimmi, that a wider NUT is for the purpose of wider string spacing ? Or is just to fill in the gap at the end of the fretboard ?

I think the problem comes from playing any one particular Guitar, for a long period of time. If you have several guitars, and switch between them periodically, I think you will see that nut width, and string spacing will be MUCH LESS an issue, practically Nil.

Dan
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  #36  
Old 11-13-2014, 11:33 AM
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If you feel like you need more room, then you probably do. 1 3/4 minimum. My favorite nut width is 1 13/16 on acoustic.
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  #37  
Old 11-13-2014, 04:11 PM
Brad13122 Brad13122 is offline
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I went and played some today. I definitely prefer the wider nut width. The martin performing artist series felt the best of any I played today. Taylor says the string spacing is the same on all their models but to me the 416 I played definitely felt wider than the 214. It's not a deal breaker for me as I've been learning on a 1 11/16 since I started but for a lot of chords and some picking stuff that I'm learning I'm definitely better on the 1 3/4.
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  #38  
Old 11-13-2014, 04:12 PM
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String spacing plays a greater role than nut width.
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  #39  
Old 11-13-2014, 04:25 PM
dhalbert dhalbert is offline
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Originally Posted by Brad13122 View Post
Taylor says the string spacing is the same on all their models but to me the 416 I played definitely felt wider than the 214.
Taylor means the string spacing at the bridge/saddle is the same for all their models: it's 2-3/16". The nut width varies: 1-11/16" for the 1xx and 2xx models, and 1-3/4" for the 3xx and up.

It can be confusing: "string spacing" is ambiguous, so people usually say "nut width" or "string spacing at the saddle". But to further compound the issue, the nut width and the string spacing at the nut may not always be consistent. For instance, a 1-3/4" nut usually has 1-1/2" string spacing at the nut. But Seagulls with a 1.8" nut also have 1-1/2" string spacing at the nut, despite the slightly wider nut width.
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  #40  
Old 11-13-2014, 04:27 PM
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I prefer 1 11/16. I played a couple of 1 3/4 Martins at Gruhn's today and did not like them.
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  #41  
Old 11-13-2014, 05:49 PM
Brad13122 Brad13122 is offline
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Originally Posted by dhalbert View Post
Taylor means the string spacing at the bridge/saddle is the same for all their models: it's 2-3/16". The nut width varies: 1-11/16" for the 1xx and 2xx models, and 1-3/4" for the 3xx and up.

It can be confusing: "string spacing" is ambiguous, so people usually say "nut width" or "string spacing at the saddle". But to further compound the issue, the nut width and the string spacing at the nut may not always be consistent. For instance, a 1-3/4" nut usually has 1-1/2" string spacing at the nut. But Seagulls with a 1.8" nut also have 1-1/2" string spacing at the nut, despite the slightly wider nut width.

So the string spacing on the 416 was probably wider than the 214? That's what I was thinking but the wording of it had me confused.
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  #42  
Old 11-13-2014, 05:52 PM
dhalbert dhalbert is offline
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Originally Posted by Brad13122 View Post
So the string spacing on the 416 was probably wider than the 214? That's what I was thinking but the wording of it had me confused.
The string spacing at the nut on the 416 is wider than the spacing at the nut on the 214. At the saddle, they have the same spacing.

Does that match your impression of how it played? You would probably notice more of a difference making chords than doing fingerstyle.
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  #43  
Old 11-13-2014, 05:57 PM
kmcmichael kmcmichael is offline
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Originally Posted by DanPanther View Post
It seems to be an issue with most beginners. Once you build callouses, and a bit of technique, I think for the most part you will no longer have an issue with nut width.

Dan

I disagree. I did not care about nut width for the first 25 years and I gigged six nights a week from 82 to 87. About 15 years ago I went to 1 3/4. Now I am at 1 7/8. Recently I have developed Authritus and plan to sell everything under that.
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  #44  
Old 11-13-2014, 07:47 PM
BillyHank BillyHank is offline
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I started with classical guitar because I have very large hands and especially the fingers. I just stayed away from steel strings most of my life because of the narrow spacing of the strings.

I decided to try a steel string and bought a Martin HD-28 without ever having played one. Yeah it sure did have a lot of getting use to, but I managed and then I decided to buy a D-18 because of the performance neck and wider string settings - a big difference for me, but not huge.

I love this old HD-28 so much I am never giving it up and the D-18 is icing on the cake.

Bill G
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  #45  
Old 11-13-2014, 09:25 PM
Brad13122 Brad13122 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhalbert View Post
The string spacing at the nut on the 416 is wider than the spacing at the nut on the 214. At the saddle, they have the same spacing.

Does that match your impression of how it played? You would probably notice more of a difference making chords than doing fingerstyle.

I think it does match. I didn't notice anything plucking strings with my strumming hand. Making chords was easier though because I didn't tend to mute a string unintentionally. On the narrower strings sometimes my fingernail will barely touch the string right above it. Never have that issue on the performing artist or the 416 i played.
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