NGD: Nylon Savoy

[Strumalot]

OK, I've actually had the Savoy since November 2017 ~ and it wasn't specifically made for nylon strings ~ but a recent experiment made it like a new guitar day.

Here's my story...

I didn't need another guitar, however, I was intrigued with the idea of an instrument that is made from the same basic ingredient that I throw in my oatmeal every day.

Opens up some possibilities. As a friend suggested, at the end of a show, I could start playing with my teeth and then eat the instrument!

This could really do it for the band. So I ordered... sunburst finish, black headstock, Gotoh 510 tuners, K&K electos, no sound port.

About six months later, it showed up, looked great, and the Made-In-Frisco Savoy was a good prop for a video we were working on called An Old Hippie's Last Request...



The Savoy, however, didn't play and sound as expected and it was no match for my CA GX in terms of playability, comfort, tone, and whackability (the Savoy is almost too nice looking for duty around here).

While the Savoy has some great sonic qualities, and may be perfect for some players and styles, for my purposes, it has some unwanted "edgyness," tends to accentuate string squeak, and is lacking in bass.

The set up was also high compared to what I am used to with my Strat and plays-like-a-Strat GX.

Consequently, the Savoy hasn't been getting much play time.

In case you're wondering whether opting out of the sound port is a factor in bass response, I asked Joe about it. I was curious whether a downward port would be effective (I didn't want a hole on the top of my guitar). The response was, "a sound port can work anywhere I'd guess given the omni nature of bass. I am not sure it is necessary though. We just liked the balance a bit more with versus without."

Despite the sound and set up issues, the Savoy is fun to play and it's a perfect size and weight for portability. I really wanted to bond with the thing.

So I did some experimenting with strings including the shipped-with 80/20s, Reds, D'Addario Flatwounds, Silk and Steel, and Newtone "heavy bass" Doublewounds.

The Flatwounds took care of the string squeak and the Silk and Steel improved he bass, the Newtones and Reds always sound pretty good, but nothing got the Savoy to where I wanted it for a keeper and a complement to the GX.

In a last ditch attempt to save it from the used guitar market I took a clue from my X10N and slapped on a set of D'Addario Nylon Folk Strings.

~and~

Ta Da!... nice warm full bass, the edginess is gone, and the extra string slop makes up for the set up issue. Plus, there is still that Savoy "magic resonance" to the sound.

I am still a little shocked at the difference and keep testing it to make sure I am hearing things right. And maybe I'm not. Maybe some of the other Savoy owners will do some testing. It's easy to do; won't mess up your guitar... the nut didn't need any modifications to make it work.

Nylon Savoy vs. X10N

I will need a string change on the X10N to do a fair comparison, but as things are now, the Savoy is much warmer, "thicker," and has more "depth" and resonance. And this is sort interesting... if you play it hard with a pick (I use a stiff carbon fibre pick) it sounds amped with some light distortion. Yeah, Rockin' Boogie on the Little Nylon; let that open E chord ring (the Savoy's super sustain helps with the Stack-of-Marshalls effect).

As you might expect, the volume and "projection" are decreased with the nylon strings, but that can be a benefit. With some design tweaking I am sure eKoa would have plenty of power and projection.

eKoa may be the ultimate composit material for nylon guitars and I hope Blackbird will give us some "official" options in that area. I would also be interested in a larger, bigger sounding, full-bass eKoa steel string with CA-like features (thin neck, no heel, normal headstock, sculpted back, etc.), but I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon.

Meanwhile, I will sit back and enjoy my little mellow kick-back-on-the-couch Nylon Savoy!

...and that's my story.

[Captain Jim]

Interesting premise. I think I will try some nylon strings on one of the wood guitars that doesn't get much play time. Thanks for posting this.

Strumalot;

I find your report really interesting from a number of perspectives. I have tried nylon strings on a number of steel string instruments and while tonal qualities have remained good, projection really weakened. I look forward to new strings on your X10N and the subsequent comparison.

A number of people have suggested that the Savoy might be converted to a nylon string and your report supports the suggestion.

[jricc]

Congrats on a cool new guitar

[kramster]

That made for some fine reading ...thanks Sir Strumalot.. I shoulda got the Sunburst as I may have grown some long hair... next time.

[kramster]

How is it plugged in with said strings?

Mr. K;

Superb question. Steel stings are generally picked up by magnetism while nylon strings supplant magic for magnetism and require a special pickup.

[kramster]

He has K&Ks in it

[Braindead]

How bout carbon strings?

[Strumalot]

I am curious about the plugged in sound, too. Both the X10N and the Savoy have K&Ks and I have a pre amp for them.

Last night I gave the X10N to someone who needed it more that me, but it will be back for a Nylon Savoy vs. X10N test. We'll do a plug in test, too.

Captain Jim, I will be curious to hear about your experiments. When I tried the nylon thing on my old Taylor 710 it didn't work out, which is why I was very surprised at the results on the Savoy.

Kramster, you're right about the Sunburst! It's an amazing diffence...



BrainDead, yeah, next step would be to start testing different strings. Does this process ever end???

Stay "Tuned" [hard to do with fresh nylon strings]...

[sirwhale]

Originally Posted by Braindead

How bout carbon strings?

Yea, I agree. Put on some Savarez Alliance trebles. You'll need to tie a good knot at the end first as they don't have ball ends.

I love Savarez Alliance on my flamenco guitar, much more than nylon.

[kramster]

I might just stick some John Pearse (Thomastik-Infeld) Folk fingerpicking PJ 116 on me Savoy...maybe my hair will grow just a bit...

I'm not sure a comparison between the Emerald nylon and Savoy steel will reveal much difference. I believe that the early Emerald nylon 10, like some other CF early nylon models, was essentially a steel string with nylon string ties and wider nut width. There was, I think, the hope that the same guitar face would suffice for both nylon and steel strings. The Brunner demonstrated the hope with a guitar body and interchangeable necks.

I don't think the hope was realized. The relatively new Rainsong nylon string Parlor is faced differently than the steel string and my relatively new Emerald X10-OSN is faced differently than the steel string 10s. They both sing quite well.

The extra strength needed for steel strings does not resonate well with the lower tension nylon strings. High tension nylon strings will probably push up the volume on a steel string, but I don't see how that could ever bring a steel string guitar to the level of a good classical guitar.

I suspect that Joe will eventually get around to a nylon string Savoy, but I'd bet he faces it differently than the steel string.

[kramster]

Guess we shall face it when we come to it... or something like that.

[Ukulele_Eddie]

That is a nice looking Savoy. I have not heard of trying nylon strings on theirs. Very interesting and I'm glad you found what worked for you. Enjoy!