Feedback Welcome on sound quality of my new Goodall TROM

cfreeland · #1 05-18-2012, 08:28 PM

I purchased a brand new Goodall TROM (traditional OM) about 6 weeks ago. It was a bit of an impulse buy when I was traveling and had access to a great guitar shop (Rudy's in NYC).
I had it shipped to Hawaii where I live.
I've been playing it and compared to my other guitars (see list below) - the sound seems trapped inside the stiff Engelmann spruce top. It's like the sound is just choked. There's just no projection or volume coming through acoustically. It's a gorgeous guitar, plays well and sounds great with the Anthem pickup. But acoustically, the voice just isn't coming through.
I'd love some thoughts on this.
Thanks!

jseth · #2 05-18-2012, 10:38 PM

Hard to believe that a Goodall sounds "choked", or that the sound is trapped, in any way. I have a Goodall GC (same size/shape as the OM) with a Venetian cutaway, mahogany with a redwood top... and that little dude is LOUD, but in a very balanced, responsive way.

You didn't say what wood the b/s are, but I know that James tunes every top on each guitar he builds... you might give him a call and see what he says; perhaps something got out of whack when it was shipped? I don't know...

I do know that putting the Anthem in my Mark Angus 6 string altered both the tone and the volume of the instrument, an instrument that I have played every day for the past 33 years (well, nearly every day!) since Mark made it for me. I cite this as my basis of familiarity to notice the changes from the (my best guess) the braided Element component of the Anthem... along with really flattening out the tonal characteristics of this particular guitar, I estimate a 5-10% loss of volume...

The Anthem may be part of the problem, but even that shouldn't cause the guitar to sound dead or dull... Funny, if your guitar was really built 6 weeks ago, I probably played it before it left James' shop! I just moved from Fort Bragg a couple weeks ago; prior to moving, I would stop by his shop frequently and play whatever was ready to be shipped... lots of fun!

Again, I would call James and talk about the guitar, if you love it and want to keep it. Otherwise, return it and start from scratch...

Good luck, whatever course of action you choose!

play on...............................>

John

usb_chord · #3 05-18-2012, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cfreeland

I purchased a brand new Goodall TROM (traditional OM) about 6 weeks ago. It was a bit of an impulse buy when I was traveling and had access to a great guitar shop (Rudy's in NYC).
I had it shipped to Hawaii where I live.
I've been playing it and compared to my other guitars (see list below) - the sound seems trapped inside the stiff Engelmann spruce top. It's like the sound is just choked. There's just no projection or volume coming through acoustically. It's a gorgeous guitar, plays well and sounds great with the Anthem pickup. But acoustically, the voice just isn't coming through.
I'd love some thoughts on this.
Thanks!

My TROMc (having an Adi top) was a little stiff when I got it, but over the past year as it continues to grown into itself (with lots of play time) it is evolving as I'd expect it to: more of everything that made me fall in love in the first place. Fabulous from day one, now moving closer to otherworldly. The things I associate with the TROM are headroom, deep low-end, "fat" trebles, generous sustain and tonal complexity to spare. Your description of that Goodall doesn't sound like any of the 50 or so I've played. Well, maybe one.

If your particular Goodall TROM isn't floating your boat, I'd suggest selling it and getting something else that does. I think boutique guitars are too expensive to settle for anything less than ideal. That instrument needs to serve you. Sounds like it doesn't.

oldrocker · #4 05-19-2012, 03:16 AM

Adi tops take some time to loosen up and start playing more open and less tight. They get better with age and a lot of play. When I got my Collings the origial owner had not played it much. I've played it daily for 15 minute to sometimes an hour and alter between fingers and a flatpick. After a few months the differece in open airy overtones and volume is significant. Its getting so fun to play I don't want to put it down.. Its just becomine more and more tonally appealing. I've had this experience with every Adi top guitar I've owned. Play it hard and often and see what happens in a couple of months.

cfreeland · #5 05-19-2012, 03:41 AM

Hey, thanks a lot for sharing your thoughts.

The b/s are Indian rosewood.

I had a feeling that maybe the Anthem had something to do with it. When I played it in the store, I was blown away by it - I bought it with the instruction to install the Anthem and ship it to me. So I hadn't played it with the pickup installed. And that may be a factor.

I like your idea of calling James and talking with him about it.

Maybe Engelmann spruce is a particularly stiff wood. My Goodall parlor with cedar top and koa b/s sounds so much more opened up - it's a startling difference.

I'll share after the phone call what we came up with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jseth

Hard to believe that a Goodall sounds "choked", or that the sound is trapped, in any way. I have a Goodall GC (same size/shape as the OM) with a Venetian cutaway, mahogany with a redwood top... and that little dude is LOUD, but in a very balanced, responsive way.

You didn't say what wood the b/s are, but I know that James tunes every top on each guitar he builds... you might give him a call and see what he says; perhaps something got out of whack when it was shipped? I don't know...

I do know that putting the Anthem in my Mark Angus 6 string altered both the tone and the volume of the instrument, an instrument that I have played every day for the past 33 years (well, nearly every day!) since Mark made it for me. I cite this as my basis of familiarity to notice the changes from the (my best guess) the braided Element component of the Anthem... along with really flattening out the tonal characteristics of this particular guitar, I estimate a 5-10% loss of volume...

The Anthem may be part of the problem, but even that shouldn't cause the guitar to sound dead or dull... Funny, if your guitar was really built 6 weeks ago, I probably played it before it left James' shop! I just moved from Fort Bragg a couple weeks ago; prior to moving, I would stop by his shop frequently and play whatever was ready to be shipped... lots of fun!

Again, I would call James and talk about the guitar, if you love it and want to keep it. Otherwise, return it and start from scratch...

Good luck, whatever course of action you choose!

play on...............................>

John

cfreeland · #6 05-19-2012, 03:45 AM

Thanks - this makes me feel hopeful. The top is Engelmann spruce which I've heard is a very stiff wood, Indian rosewood b/s. I've been intuitively strumming the heck out of it for a few minutes a day as well as finger picking a fair amount which is my main style.

I'm going to call James and chat with him about it and also take your advice and play it a lot.

Will post an update soon.

thanks again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldrocker

Adi tops take some time to loosen up and start playing more open and less tight. They get better with age and a lot of play. When I got my Collings the origial owner had not played it much. I've played it daily for 15 minute to sometimes an hour and alter between fingers and a flatpick. After a few months the differece in open airy overtones and volume is significant. Its getting so fun to play I don't want to put it down.. Its just becomine more and more tonally appealing. I've had this experience with every Adi top guitar I've owned. Play it hard and often and see what happens in a couple of months.

cfreeland · #7 05-19-2012, 03:52 AM

Thanks a lot for weighing in on this.
All of these responses have been quite helpful.
Someone suggested that the Anthem pickup may have shifted the tone and stole some of the volume away which I think may have some validity.
But I'm going to call James and chat about it. And play the heck out of it and see what happens.
I did try to sell it here and on e-Bay but with no success. Plus Rudy's will only do store credit and not even the full dollar for dollar trade. But it's a beautiful guitar and I do feel a fondness for it that may grow with time into something special.
It's quite heavy too, compared with my others. And I have 4 serious guitars and not one of them is a cutaway and that would be really useful. So we'll see what the future holds.Will post an update.

thanks again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by usb_chord

My TROMc (having an Adi top) was a little stiff when I got it, but over the past year as it continues to grown into itself (with lots of play time) it is evolving as I'd expect it to: more of everything that made me fall in love in the first place. Fabulous from day one, now moving closer to otherworldly. The things I associate with the TROM are headroom, deep low-end, "fat" trebles, generous sustain and tonal complexity to spare. Your description of that Goodall doesn't sound like any of the 50 or so I've played. Well, maybe one.

If your particular Goodall TROM isn't floating your boat, I'd suggest selling it and getting something else that does. I think boutique guitars are too expensive to settle for anything less than ideal. That instrument needs to serve you. Sounds like it doesn't.

cfreeland · #8 05-19-2012, 04:21 AM

Hey Brian - just watched your YouTube vid - great playing and some great tunes!

usb_chord · #9 05-19-2012, 08:12 AM

Thank you! I'm hoping to get some nicer, professional recordings of the TROM done pretty soon.

JohnnyDes · #10 05-19-2012, 12:29 PM

I had a similar problem with my Larrivee OM-09. Two things helped. First, an Ivory saddle. Second, heavier gauge strings. If you like lights, the Martin 4150s are a good compromise.

Although these helped, in the end I sold the Larrivee. My new Martin OM-21 is more lightly built and does what I want.

JD

Jamie9 · #11 05-19-2012, 10:15 PM

Looking at the list of guitars you already own it seems a little like you all the bases covered already.
It was my experience too with a new(ish) adi/rw om that I didn't really like. For nearly a year I played it before it seemed to really ring, but I just kept my other guitar in its case and played the om until either I got used to it or it got used to me . I really like it now.
I enjoyed Brians playing too and thank him for inspiring me to have another go at the Intuite book, **** those stretches.
Good luck I'm sure if it hasn't got a setup issue you'll get to love it.

darylcrisp · #12 05-19-2012, 11:48 PM

couple things i would think of.
if i understand correct, you played it and really loved its sound/tone "before" the pickup was installed, and before the guitar was shipped.

1)very possible the pickup braid strip is not allowing the saddle to seat correctly in the slot at the bridge-happened to a brand new Gibson i used to own. Its a simple matter to slip that pickup strip out and try the saddle straight into the bridge to see if it helps(i would assume the saddle has been sanded lower to allow proper height for the pickup strip-you can cut(with a razor) thin strips of paper and lay inside the saddle slot to temporarily raise it-as long as the saddle fits down and snug the waves will transfer.

2)very possible the saddle is not square on the bottom if the shop shaved it down to lower it for the pickup strip-hence, a bad connection in the slot which easily results in lose of volume and tone

3)very possible the guitar has over humidified during shipping-i would check the humidity level with an accurate hygrometer while the guitar is cased for a day to see.

good luck and keep us updated on your findings
d

neildealdylan · #13 05-20-2012, 02:40 AM

Hi, I own a Goodall TROM & it's the only guitar in my herd of Goodalls that I can consider to be a lifetime keeper as I ebb & flow in styles, thoughts & opinions etc. I just cannot put my TROM down & particularly valued Brian's (USB Chord) input on the TROM's qualities.Apart from the fact that Brian is an incredible guitarist, his analysis of the TROM is second to none. Regarding your TROM, I'm just wondering whether I'm missing something obvious here? Is this TROM a specific customised order because I thought the regular TROM was made with an adi top (hard & stiff, takes some playing in & versatile in styles) not an Engelmann top (much softer,spongier,better for F/S play than strumming etc). There's a world of difference between Engelmann & adirondack, as most members know. Regarding my own TROM? I've never played such a powerful OM sized guitar with such versatility.Even though James made it specifically for flatpicking, I love to play it equally for all styles....a great little strummer but I especially like it for fingerstyle & love the dark,rich rosewood tone (combined with the lush overtones, of course).I find it's compact size & neck size perfect for my guitar skills & technique....I simply cannot fault it! So I am intrigued by your comments & hope (for your sake) that it is an adi top that simply needs some time & patience to break in....then you'll be in heaven! Good luck anyway & I'll be interested to hear the results of your conversation with James.NC

Anand00028 · #14 05-20-2012, 04:47 AM

Love my TROM with EIR /ADI !
I wouldn't call it my best 'all around' guitar but the clarity and sustain are amazing. The overtones are lush but not overdone. The body size is just right!

pitner · #15 05-20-2012, 05:12 AM

If it were mine I would use a Tonerite on it to open up the top. If you don.t have a TR just play the snot out of it and it should open up on it's own. My Goodall is a Royal Hawaiian and it responded well to a short 48 hour TR treatment.