Funny thing about tuners…

[Slothead56]

When I bought a Guild D-25 in 1974 (my first serious guitar, one I played all through college, learned to perform on) I clearly knew nothing about guitars.

It had open back tuners and more than anything I wanted closed back tuners…thought they were “better”. Never got around to changing them before selling the guitar and buying my Gurian JR, which has closed back Schallers.

Now, some 50 years a later, it seems many, many higher end guitars are equipped with open back tuners including my Martin OM-28.

Evolution in thought??

[Marshall]

It's always been more about aesthetics than function.

[sinistral]

Originally Posted by Marshall

It's always been more about aesthetics than function.

I was going to say that it’s more of a fashion thing—there are excellent tuners in each variety.

As part of its reimagining (and proto-reimagining of Styles 18 and 21), Martin switched back to open-back tuners on guitars with vintage origins (e.g., Styles 18, 21, 28, etc.), but uses closed-back tuners on more modern styles (e.g., Style 35, etc.), with some exceptions (e.g., open-back tuners on Style 40 and 41, which are modern-era variations of vintage styles). It does seem as if the super-duper premium tuners are open-back (Rodgers, Scheller, etc.).

[davidd]

It's called the internet... we are all lemmings.

[Robin, Wales]

Don't worry. In 50 years time folks will be fitting closed backed tuners for that vintage early 2000s look.

[rllink]

Originally Posted by davidd

It's called the internet... we are all lemmings.

That about covers it.

[Bob Womack]

This was one of those fashions that passed through first in the '70s. Folks were convinced that the Kluson semi-open pegs delivered on Gibson Les Pauls up until about 1976 were crap. As a result, nearly everyone replaced the Klusons with Schallers or Grovers, both of wheich required a hole to be drilled. It turned out that always tuning UP to pitch was what was required.

Now, decades later, that little indulgence can cost you hundreds of dollars at resale time, taking a guitar from collector to player grade.

Bob

[J Patrick]

Originally Posted by davidd

It's called the internet... we are all lemmings.

we were swapping our open back tuners for closed back tuners decades before the Internet…..collective conscious is easily manipulated……and it’s human nature to desire the next best thing, whether it’s a set of Grover Rotomatics or butterbean Waverlies….I’ll admit that the Internet has made it easier than ever to influence the masses……..but….it’s also given us the means to better inform ourselves before making choices…

Since I’ve never met two alike individual humans…..I’m gonna say we’re not all lemmings…..

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by J Patrick

Since I’ve never met two alike individual humans…..I’m gonna say we’re not all lemmings…..

Incidentally to the lemmings discussion, my '74 Les Paul Standard that I purchased in 1977 still has its original two ring Klusons.





Bob

[b1j]

Originally Posted by Slothead56

Never got around to changing them before selling the guitar and buying my Gurian JR, which has closed back Schallers.

I was marveling the other day at how smoothly, precisely, and securely the Schallers work on my Gurian. Does it have anything to do with being closed? Or are they just well made?

Since that was my only guitar for decades, I developed a suspicion that open tuners could accumulated dust or grit and become less sensitive. And the places I brought my Gurian in the early days might well have built up grit in open tuners. Now, of course, I treat my guitars as fine instruments, like my tools, so they aren’t exposed to gritty environments.

All four of the other acoustics — even the granddaddy 0-18 — have open tuners. I even switched the closed Grover strap set to open Waverlys on my J-45. Not because they were open, I just thought the factory set was fussy to dial in and I wanted to go with 21:1 ratio.

But the Schallers stay.

[zuzu]

It is possible that open back tuners give a particular guitar a more balanced feel when playing, as they can be lighter and account for a lighter head stock. This is a big factor on a bass, where the size and weight of the tuners can maximize or minimize neck dive a surprising amount. But I'm not too sure it is a big factor in any way on a guitar, I think it's merely a preference.

[The Bard Rocks]

Originally Posted by zuzu

It is possible that open back tuners give a particular guitar a more balanced feel when playing, as they can be lighter and account for a lighter head stock. This is a big factor on a bass, where the size and weight of the tuners can maximize or minimize neck dive a surprising amount. But I'm not too sure it is a big factor in any way on a guitar, I think it's merely a preference.

Aesthetics aside, this is the only reason I see to use open back ones. When I started playing, it was preached that the closed ones were better as they accumulated less grit and other stuff. Today, either is OK with me.

[tommieboy]

Originally Posted by Slothead56

When I bought a Guild D-25 in 1974 (my first serious guitar, one I played all through college, learned to perform on) I clearly knew nothing about guitars.

It had open back tuners and more than anything I wanted closed back tuners…thought they were “better”. Never got around to changing them before selling the guitar and buying my Gurian JR, which has closed back Schallers.

Now, some 50 years a later, it seems many, many higher end guitars are equipped with open back tuners including my Martin OM-28.

Evolution in thought??

You may have had a set of tuners similar to the one in the photo below. The Matsumoku guitar company in Japan made them, and they are simply my favorite vintage tuners of all time. Not too many swore by them, but many swore at them. I had access to an automotive machine shop, so I had access to high-tech baked-on coatings, high-tech nylon washers, etc., and the guy we called the Russian. There was nothing that he couldn't tweak with a gentle tap from his 13-pound sledgehammer.





Tommy

[musicman1951]

A timely post for me as I've grown weary of the tension on my Waverly tuners - too stiff. I don't know if it's the magic missing tool that's the solution or possibly how they were installed, but I guess I'm due for a trip to my luthier.

If there were a drop in replacement from Gotoh I'd probably just go that way. The closed Gotoh tuners on my Lowden were magnificent but I don't know that they would be appropriate for my Martin 000-42 Marquis.

[Murphy Slaw]

You can tune faster with open tuners because they won't overheat like closed ones will.