Poll – Has your Martin had binding problems?

[massimo]

3 out of 3 here, 2012, 2019, 2019.
My 2005, 2008 and 1963 no problem.

[BluesKing777]

As mentioned a time or two now, 3 various Martins from that period with binding problems....1st (CEO7) I took to get fixed took a month, next 2 (000-17 and D-18) took 7 months to get back. All needed finish work as well - repairs upsetr the finish.

D18 came off again, took it back, fixed, sold it. Loss - repaired guitar sounded dodgy to buyers.....

NO lifetime warranty except the sale warranty, a few months, outside the US. (Paid for repairs myself).

BluesKing777.

[Slimt]

I had the 41 authentic covered under warranty , it took 6 months Then I found out the whole guitar was refinished by there warranty repair tech. . I told the Dealer To refund my complete purchase .

So there is more involved than just a re glue. I did find out the Martin Repair was done with CA glue.

[zoopeda]

Pretty sure it’s really a matter of when, not if. But it’s not a difficult or expensive fix. And it’s not clear the problem has even been fixed yet. (There was a report of a 2021 that’s already had it). Honestly, you can get problems or issues with any builder. I have a high end boutique guitar that sounds incredible and just needed a neck reset because the original was crap. At the end of my lifetime of guitar playing, I’m going to remember the lifetime of music enjoyed on that guitar, not the cost of the repair. Small potatoes.

[Jimi2]

I have a 2018 om28, and fortunately no signs of a problem so far.

[Gryf]

My immediate take-away from the poll as it stands now is that at least 46 people bought Martin guitars and the bindings have come loose. In reality, we know that the actual number of poorly constructed instruments (may as well call it what it is) is much, much higher.And unless I've missed something, Martin has never publicly commented on it. No surprise, I suppose.

I bought one in 2016, and it has binding issues at the waist. I haven't bothered to get it fixed yet, because I just can't get excited about the 2 hour drive to the nearest Martin repair person, nor the undetermined amount of time I'll have to leave it before trekking back again.

I've had many guitars over the last 50+ years of playing, some inexpensive, some expensive, and this is the only guitar, electric or acoustic, that I've ever had problems with.

I've said this before, and I believe it firmly-Martin still makes some great guitars, but the Martin of today will not as highly thought of and sought after as the Martin guitar of yesterday.

[kizz]

Not that I have to sit and defend Martin because I think that you expect this kind of thing to be okay when you pay a lot of money for a guitar, but if you take the period from 2010-2020, then Martin probably made in the vicinity of close to a million guitars, so when 46 people or let's just say 10,000 for that matter have had the problem, how big of a problem is it fairly obsessively compared to guitars produced in that decade? From what I have been able to read, most cases are no worse than what a dab of glue and a piece of tape can handle.

[yaharadelta]

I have two cases of binding separation, one is a 2017 000-28EC, at each side on the topside waist. The other is a 2016 CEO-7, at the waist on the topside treble side. Both purchased new, so under warranty. They both sound so good, and fit and finish wise there are no issues, I don't anticipate selling either. I had the 000 looked at and it was suggested that it would be an easier repair If I waited for it to get worse so that it would be easier to remove the binding for the fix.

[donlyn]

Has your Martin had binding problems?

What Martin ?



Don
.

[Br1ck]

Look, there is a known and documented four year period when for regulatory reasons, Martin had to change their glue. It took some time for the issue to show up. My 2014 from the known four year period took eight years to materialize. Three days at Gryphon and it was fixed on warranty with no problems. Saying Martin has binding issues by saying my 30+ year old Martin has binding separation is like saying my 90 Ford truck is bad because it blew a head gasket. There is almost universal celluloid binding issues on those twenties guitars, and hide glue is causing braces to come lose too.

[davidd]

Originally Posted by Br1ck

Look, there is a known and documented four year period when for regulatory reasons, Martin had to change their glue. It took some time for the issue to show up. My 2014 from the known four year period took eight years to materialize. Three days at Gryphon and it was fixed on warranty with no problems. Saying Martin has binding issues by saying my 30+ year old Martin has binding separation is like saying my 90 Ford truck is bad because it blew a head gasket. There is almost universal celluloid binding issues on those twenties guitars, and hide glue is causing braces to come lose too.

Well, if it is a known and documented manufacturing error then why hasn't Martin actually acknowledged the issue? It isn't so much that this has been happening on such a large scale with their guitars, but that Martin has been deceptive by their omission of taking any responsibility other than having under warranty guitars in the USA repaired. If you bought outside of the USA or used in the USA you are out of luck.

They obviously are afraid of the Lemon Laws kicking in and therefore being on the hook for potentially millions of dollars in repair costs.

[TheGITM]

Originally Posted by davidd

They obviously are afraid of the Lemon Laws kicking in and therefore being on the hook for potentially millions of dollars in repair costs.

Just fyi - the 'lemon law' only applies to vehicles. There is no equivalent for acoustic guitars.

[davidd]

Originally Posted by TheGITM

Just fyi - the 'lemon law' only applies to vehicles. There is no equivalent for acoustic guitars.

Wrong... here in California our Lemon Laws cover almost every consumer item, including instruments.

The California Lemon Laws Basic Rules Apply to All Consumer Goods
The “California lemon law” statute is formally titled the “Song-Beverly Consumer Warranty Act,” and is located California Civil Code Sections 1790 – 1795.8. The lemon law’s rules and requirements generally apply to “consumer goods,” which are defined by the California lemon law (at California Civil Code Section 1791(a)) to mean “any new product or part thereof that is used, bought, or leased for use primarily for personal, family, or household purposes, except for clothing and consumables.” Accordingly, most of the provisions of the California lemon law apply to ALL consumer goods other than clothing and consumable (e.g., fruits and vegetables, cosmetics, over-the-counter drugs, etc.).

[Sadie-f]

Originally Posted by TheGITM

Just fyi - the 'lemon law' only applies to vehicles. There is no equivalent for acoustic guitars.

He's floated this idea before, doubtless will say you're wrong. IAC at $50 per unit repair, we're talking 40,000 units to get to "millions". I don't think there's that many failed bindings out there 🤷🏼*♀️.

[sinistral]

Originally Posted by Sadie-f

He's floated this idea before, doubtless will say you're wrong. IAC at $50 per unit repair, we're talking 40,000 units to get to "millions". I don't think there's that many failed bindings out there ����*♀️.

It’s like a broken record. Unless there’s another definition, my reading is that the lemon laws only apply to new consumer goods, unless those goods are assistive devices. There are special provisions for items such as wheelchairs that include the term “used.”

1791. As used in this chapter:
(a) "Consumer goods" means any new product or part thereof that is used, bought, or leased for use primarily for personal, family, or household purposes, except for clothing and consumables. "Consumer goods" shall include new and used assistive devices sold at retail.

I would be interested if anyone can point to where used consumer goods other than assistive devices (e.g., guitars) are covered.