Looking for fast, accurate chromatic tuner that displays cents

[RJVB]

Originally Posted by b1j

Would you consider a clip-on?

My experiences with those haven't been great to be honest, all of the good ones seem to have compulsory auto-off and I like to be able to put the tuner on or under my music stand.

Originally Posted by ljguitar

The biggest problem I have with tuners which display frequency/cents constantly, is they displays don't freeze or lock-onto pitches. They keep moving (because pitches/strings fluctuate with volume/decay).

I know, right? Thing is, how can you lock-in when pitch changes constantly? I prefer to see the confirmation of what I hear, and get the pitch fluctuation into an acceptable range that I define myself.

Originally Posted by Purfle Haze

Your question makes me curious about your tuning practices. Do you tune to non-standard (meaning not Equal Temperament) tuning? Do you re-tune during your practice, or just at the start, or what?

Heh, all of the above except that you can't really escape ET on a guitar I come from violin and period performance where I worked with players using temperaments like Werckmeister or Valotti, and singers who simply sang in tune (I never know if "just intonation" is quite that...). I rarely used a tuner to verify my intonation back in the day, but that became quite commonplace among advanced students when those devices became smaller and less expensive.

Of course I tune when I start practising (with nylon strings often after some warm-up exercises on open strings which also warms them up and would detune them). But I'll retune when necessary, and I find that's necessary more often with my archtop (I'm guessing that has to do with the non negligible bit of string behind the saddle). Plus, I'm trying strings that sound really nice but are very sensitive to pressure and push the limits of what's possible with compensation at the saddle. So I tune the A string 4 cents flat for instance.
It's really a bit like the old "art de préluder" except with me it's not an art that sounds like improvisation over the key chords of the piece you're going to play

In fact, it's been a long time since I stopped playing the violin and I think that playing a fretted instrument has made my ears a bit too lazy (I find it much easier to continue to play on a guitar I know to be out of tune). That's another reason why I have start to keep a tuner on in my field of view.

[Aspiring]

Originally Posted by Purfle Haze

Wow! I have the Peterson iPhone app (though I much prefer the Airyware) and it displays cents and tenths. I am surprised to hear that the clip-on version doesn't display cents. I thought that the hardware version would have the same features as the app, but I guess not!



All best!

I have the stroboclip HD. It does the strobe thing and doesn't put numbers up so no way that I know of to read how far off you are exactly other than "faster" or "slower"

[donlyn]

Looking for fast, accurate chromatic tuner that displays cents

Originally Posted by donlyn

Hey RJVB,

Been using a Korg CA-1 chromatic tuner for many years. Has a lot of features, which they have probably improved on since I got mine 10 or 15 years ago. Don't even know if they make that model or even if the company is still in business. But worth checking out if you can find one. Had a Korg for years before this one, but I dropped it and it stopped working. (I was an early adopter of digital tuners, needing to tune 12 string guitars.) And the Korg is/was definitely more economical than your price examples depending on what features you want. And mine has taken a licking and keeps on ticking.

Don
.

Ignorance has turned into bliss.

Since I posted that quote earlier, I started playing around a bit with my tuner. Turns out that I can adjust A=440 up or down from 440 to say 441, 442, et cetera. Never used this feature before. Don't know if this is exactly what you are looking for, but it does allow a specific setting for temporary or permanent use. In the grand scheme of things, it might be the best way to set a string sharp or flat, as opposed to just returning a specific change. Might do that too. Gonna have to play around with it some more. Think I still have the original directions in my accessory box.

Might be worth a shot to chek their website for more: www.korg.com

For some guitars, I have in the past tuned the bass 'E' string(s) just a wee bit flat by ear. Seems to provide a better sound (to my ears) especially when fretting a 'G' note on the third fret. Or it might just be me fretting too hard on that note, especially in a cowboy chord form.

Don
.

[cdkrugjr]

My wife tells I I don’t have Any cents

[RJVB]

Originally Posted by donlyn

[B][I]Turns out that I can adjust A=440 up or down from 440 to say 441, 442, et cetera.

I think most tuners allow this - kinda necessary as A=440 isn't that much the official standard in practice since a long time. At least in classical music it's been creeping up along with having to be heard in ever larger venues.

Thing is, A=441Hz is +4ct, A=439Hz is -4ct (according to Airyware). A=415Hz is a semitone, A=392Hz a full tone, btw

So if you're used to tuning your open strings at -1ct (so the lower frets are better in tune) it won't do to change the reference pitch, sadly.

I found a good enough deal on the blue version of the Korg GA Custom pocket tuner (which I can always send back through A'zon Prime) and received it today. As I feared, the led scale is closer to 5ct/led than the 1ct/led suggested above (in modes 1 and 3), but they are actually used as analog indicators (they're not simply on or off; intensity varies). The strobe modes are reasonably well in agreement between the Korg and the Airyware tuner (which I checked against a Peterson).
I'll run it through its paces over the weekend and see if it fits the bill after all or if it will go back. It definitely scores in the form factor department!

[Macpage]

Originally Posted by RJVB

As I feared, the led scale is closer to 5ct/led than the 1ct/led suggested above (in modes 1 and 3), but they are actually used as analog indicators (they're not simply on or off; intensity varies).

You know I never moved the test tone more than 1 cent once the bar lit or thought about the intensity. It completely escaped me that it may stay on for a greater range before moving to the next LED. I did do 12 cents sharp which got me several LED's. I just assumed this was closer to 1 per bar. I'm afraid I did bad research for you. My bad!

I did think it would be hard to see. Do you think you can actually see them well enough to make it work now that you have a better sense of the actual scale? My eyes aren't what they used to be, but I hope you can see it ok to get close enough for your needs.

Best,

Mac

[RJVB]

Originally Posted by Macpage

I did think it would be hard to see. Do you think you can actually see them well enough to make it work now that you have a better sense of the actual scale? My eyes aren't what they used to be, but I hope you can see it ok to get close enough for your needs.

To be honest, I did think the scale would probably be closer to 5ct/led, as 5ct is the accepted error where you start considering an interval to be in tune. I don't expect to be able to distinguish more than "looks like it's coming on" and "looks like it's flickering a bit (as opposed to steady on)". I was also expecting that I'd be having to find a way to tune fretted notes that I want to be in tune. I tune my current A string to -4ct because that gives me a proper B, for instance.

That's tricky on the archtop, already when tuning open strings I often have the impression I'm turning and turning the tuner without much effect, and then all of a sudden it overshoots. I'll probably want to grow a 3rd hand now

[Robin, Wales]

Originally Posted by RJVB

Those cents are important because I often skew my tuning so specific fretted notes are in tune. I could of course tune those notes but I haven't yet learned to fret with my nose and keep an eye on the tuner at the same time

You could dispense with having the tuner in front of you when you play and simply give the fretted note you are worried about a little push or pull with your fretting finger. If it sounds like it comes into tune then it was flat; if it moves further away from tune then it was sharp. Then either adjust the string if the error is audible in different positions or adjust the way you play the chord.

I doubt that Segovia sat an electronic tuner in front of him, and I expect that he was very particular about how he tuned and how his chord intervals sounded. And I also expect that he used many subtle left and right hand techniques to adjust intonation and timbre whilst performing.

I'm sure that the TC Unitune clip-on gets so much love here on AGF because it doesn't show cents and there's a touch of leeway when using one. Therefore folks can sweetten their tuning a touch by ear and still get the green lights!

[RJVB]

Originally Posted by Robin, Wales

I doubt that Segovia sat an electronic tuner in front of him, and I expect that he was very particular about how he tuned and how his chord intervals sounded.

I'm not exactly a fan of Segovia, but who knows how he might have practised [should he have had access to a small tuner] all the long hours he undoubtedly did before he became the player he is remembered as?

What you describe is what any violinist learns to do after working on his/er intonation for a while - ever wondered why the violin family doesn't have compensated bridges? We even learn to compensate for having to push strings apart so they can sound freely.

I have already exposed my reasons why I feel like I need a good, objective listener to help me retrain my ears. Not really when I play the kind of classical strings Segovia could be using now, but on steel string guitar I often hear that an interval is off but can't decide if it's sharp or flat. And I've developed a tendancy to prefer sharp octaves and fourths when I tune by ear.
Using a tuning device that gives the green light when a note is in a ±5ct interval isn't going to help me here/hear. The fact we can accept that error and still enjoy the music doesn't mean a minimally trained (and normally healthy) ear cannot hear that it's there!

That said, I realised yesterday that a chromatic version of the TC Polytune could be useful ... play any chord and it'll indicate which notes are out of tune. I highly doubt that it's possible though

[Robin, Wales]

Originally Posted by RJVB

That said, I realised yesterday that a chromatic version of the TC Polytune could be useful ... play any chord and it'll indicate which notes are out of tune. I highly doubt that it's possible though

Unfortunately, it doesn't actually do that! It can only "here" EADGBE. And if you put on a capo you have to tell the tuner you have done that. It would be lovely it if could hear chords, but it can't.

As a dobro player in a bluegrass band the major "intonation" issue I had was when I stood between the guitarist and the banjo player and had to decide which one to follow when sliding into notes!

I do built my own dulcimers/fretted zithers in just intonation but have also played them fretted in quarter comma meantone.