NGD, Collings OM2H - trial period - UPDATE

[EverettWilliams]

I had NGD yesterday - a used Collings SJ in maple and I played for a few minutes and determined what new strings would serve me well on it and restrung.

Can't judge a guitar by old strings. Probably safest to restring with what you normally use so you can have an apples to apples comparison versus what you know.

On my OM2ha, I have come around to the John Pearse 80/20 new mediums (after veering between light and medium and 80/20 and phosphor). With Collings my preferences seem to lean towards 80/20 on rosewood and phosphor on mahogany (and Monel on Waterloo!).

It's surely not a Martin and wasn't designed to be. What some find to be overly bright and strident, I find to provide clarity and use a combination of attack, string selection, and pick selection to temper. IMO it's easier to tone down clarity than to bring clarity to a warmer and more subdued tone.

But you may just not like it and that's okay - as others have pointed out, there are a ton of guitars out there and the quest to find them is great fun. So, don't stop until you get what you want. But you owe it to yourself and the Collings to slap some strings on it, crack open a beer, and sit in a comfortable spot for a few hours to determine whether you like it and, if not, how this particular guitar shapes your tone quest moving forward. But don't let a bad first impression sully the experience.

Good luck and I'll look forward to your report on the results!

[6L6]

I'm a huge Collings fan and currently have four in my stash.

I would love to find a guitar smaller in size than a dread that sounded great to me. That is, sounded like a dread!

In all my years (started playing in 1964), I've only found one and this was it:



This 2012 Martin Custom OOO-18GE is owned by a close friend of mine in England. Here are its main features:

* Pre War, GE bracing (FSSB)
* Adi top and braces
* 1/2" deeper body

It has a K&K Pure Mini pup in it and it sounds just like a dread, plugged and unplugged.

My 70 year old ears will only settle for the tone of a good dread. I now know there is one OOO guitar on planet earth that sounds just like one. I'm seriously considering having one built identical to this one.

By now you must have followed the savvy advice above and changed the strings. How does your Collings sound?

[brencat]

Originally Posted by 6L6

I'm a huge Collings fan and currently have four in my stash.

I would love to find a guitar smaller in size than a dread that sounded great to me. That is, sounded like a dread!

In all my years (started playing in 1964), I've only found one.

My 70 year old ears will only settle for the tone of a good dread.

I'm with 6L6 here. I moved 2 Collings OM1s last year after 18 months of ownership. They are not strumming guitars... way too articulate for that duty and don't have anywhere near the warmth and bass response of a comparable Martin OM.

That said, I currently own a Martin OM-28 Authentic that I will also be listing for sale shortly. Bought that one late last year after sellings the 2 Collings. As much as I love the voicing of the OM-28A, it will never take the place of a dread for me. I have a Collings CW and a Martin CS-21-11 that get most of the playtime in my house... I'm a novice flatpicker and an OM just doesn't sound the same for bluegrass.

So it's dreads and slopes for me from here on out. I personally know what you're going through, but I'm done hoping that smaller guitars will do it for me. They don't.

Best, B

[Montesdad]

I'd try some D'A 80/20's - the strings on the guitar may be lights, maybe some mediums on the trial. 92/8 formulas usually take me too long to break in and need a few days and several hours of play to sound good.

Whenever you pick up a used guitar with a trial period, ask the shop to change the strings for you and play it for a couple of days before sending it out.

[dreamincolor]

Originally Posted by EverettWilliams

...What some find to be overly bright and strident, I find to provide clarity and use a combination of attack, string selection, and pick selection to temper. IMO it's easier to tone down clarity than to bring clarity to a warmer and more subdued tone...

My thoughts as well.

My ears have come around to favor the (what I hear) clarity and balance of Collings OM vs. Martin. I used to own a Martin OM-35 which I liked very much. But it was bass heavy, with a "scooped" midrange—not as balanced as my experience with Collings OMs. Martins tend to be warmer to my ears, while the Collings are clearer. Warm can be muddy, clear can be strident—it depends on the player and the ear. To someone who's accustomed to the tone of Martins, a Collings might sound bright and harsh, while a Collings player might find Martins to be bass heavy and muddier.

[Glennwillow]

Hi Texrun,

I have played the Collings OM2H and I own a Collings OM1A deep body custom. I also own a 1967 Martin D-35. I agree with the other posters who suggested you change the strings.

When I first tried out my Collings OM1ADB it was at Gryphon Stringed Instruments in Palo Alto. I was down there for a wedding and wanted to visit Gryphon and discovered this Collings there. My wife and I loved it. I later arranged to buy it and had it sent to me, but when it arrived, it sounded dead as can be. The strings were old. Really, it sounded VERY unimpressive.

But I immediately changed the strings to the D'Addario EJ16 strings that were factory original, and voila! It was great again.

I also bought a Santa Cruz OM/PW from Ted at LA Guitar Sales some years ago. I didn't care for the strings on that guitar and couldn't really judge the guitar based on what was on it. I called Ted and asked if I could change the strings and guaranteed him that if I scratched or harmed the guitar in any way that I would not send it back. He said OK, I changed the strings to what I thought would work better, and they did. I kept that guitar and today the OM/PW is one of my favorites. Of all my OM guitars, it sounds closest to a dreadnought, though still, not quite.

I have never found that OM guitars work well as flat picking guitars. When I flat pick a guitar, I used my old D-35 or a very nice Gibson AJ that I own.

Best of luck on this dilemma. But I would call the seller and ask if you can (carefully) change the strings and see if it makes a difference. I'm pretty sure it WILL make a difference, but it still may not be what you want in a flat picking guitar.

- Glenn

[vintageom]

Originally Posted by Montesdad

Whenever you pick up a used guitar with a trial period, ask the shop to change the strings for you and play it for a couple of days before sending it out.

Great advice for anyone buying online or in person..new strings.

I own several Collings, including a stock OM2H. From reading your original post, I would not choose an OM2H as a strummer or flat picking guitar, especially given your Martin D-35 "tone impression" in the past. YES you can flat pick and strum on the OM2H, but they are not its strongest purpose.

For what you describe, I would go with a Martin 000-18GE or Collings OM1. The mahogany back and sides control the overtones and give you punchy, warm fundamentals. These are better suited for flat picking and strumming ALONG WITH finger style and they are all-around great little guitars.

Good luck

[Glennwillow]

Originally Posted by dreamincolor

My thoughts as well.

My ears have come around to favor the (what I hear) clarity and balance of Collings OM vs. Martin. I used to own a Martin OM-35 which I liked very much. But it was bass heavy, with a "scooped" midrange—not as balanced as my experience with Collings OMs. Martins tend to be warmer to my ears, while the Collings are clearer. Warm can be muddy, clear can be strident—it depends on the player and the ear. To someone who's accustomed to the tone of Martins, a Collings might sound bright and harsh, while a Collings player might find Martins to be bass heavy and muddier.

I do agree with the above comments: there are times when clarity is really a good characteristic of a guitar. I have been learning Tommy Emmanuel's instrumental song, "Never Too Late," and of all the great guitars that I own, this song sounds best on my Collings OM1ADB. Pete Huttlinger found that the clarity of the OM1 Collings was best for his music, and I have noticed that Laurence Juber has moved towards a clearer tone with the guitars he is using these days.

So clear can be good.

However, the OP said he is a flat picker. And flat pickers usually like a fairly fat sound generally provided by a good dreadnought and the right choice of flat pick. You can certainly flat pick an OM, but I have never been satisfied with the response from the ones I own compared to how my larger guitars sound.

So it really depends on what the OP expects from his guitar.

- Glenn

[Kh1967]

It hurts my heart, just a little, to hear you are not loving the OM2H. What can I say, I am an unapologetic Collings fan and they are music to my ears. So, I am biased and I know that.

Yet, your situation sounds like a couple of things to me. One, strings will make a definite difference. Change those strings and give the Collings a fair shot. The other, while it may or may not be the case, high humidity can sometimes make the OM2H sound a little lifeless. Combine the two and you will not hear the magic.

What interests me, is that you seem to have done a bit of research and the OM2H sound appealed to you. If that is truly the case, you would need to give the guitar a chance and with dead strings, it would be unfair.

However, you may be asking this guitar to be something it is not. It is not a Martin and will never sound like one, no matter what strings you put on it. If your ear is tuned to Martin, then go find yourself the Martin of your dreams. Nothing wrong with that.

It is also possible that this particular OM2H is lacking something overall. Collings are amazingly consistent guitars, but wood is wood and that does not mean every single guitar they build is stellar. As much as I personally love Collings, not every one I pick up rattles my cage.

Finally, I am a fan of Adi bracing on Sitka topped Collings. It makes a difference to my ear. More volume, more responsive and a better feel to me. Something to also consider, particular in an OM2.

Good luck...I hope you end up happy which ever way you move forward.

[songman2]

Originally Posted by texrun38

My issue is the tone.

I just got it out of the box and while I know the strings are old (it's brand new, but has been in the shop a while), man, it sounds so thin to me.

This is just a lot of money sunk into a guitar that I love everything about, except the sound.

To me your answer is right there in those sentences. TAKE IT BACK! You will regret keeping it every time you touch it.

[MHC]

Ive already offered my advice, and you've gotten great advice and thoughts from many others on the AGF. Now I'm super curious to hear how all this is resolved. Please change those strings, give the Collings a fair shot, and report back to us what ultimately happened.

[Goodallboy]

Originally Posted by dneal

The sound didn't hit you in the boo-boo, so send it back. There's no shortage of guitars out there. You'll never convince yourself you love it, and neither will we.

Sage advice.......I agree completely, but change the strings first, just to be certain.

[texrun38]

I got some great advice from folks here as well as a friend in Montana that I called. The dealer said to absolutely change the strings. They knew they were original and they keep their guitars in cases (not out/on walls) until a customer asks to see one. Not knowing my preference for guauge, they put some D'Addario Phosphor Bronze EJ16 lights in the box. I put on the new strings then did what my friend suggested. Play it for a while, take a break, come back, play again, take a break, play something else, then sleep on it. Do the same on Sunday (today). I did just that. My wife heard me playing it w/ the new strings (obvious huge difference) and as she strolled by she said "that sounds really pretty". She also said "that sounds, well, prettier than your other guitar." I say, "Really. OK, well, which do you like better?" She says "I really like them both, but isn't the idea for them to be different?"

After the second break, I played flat picked/strummed, but I did it a bit lighter with the right hand and then...it happened. I did some singing with it. Just my voice and the guitar strummed with a light to medium strum. Holy cow! All of the sudden my ears started to hear the articulation, even-ness and just, I guess as my wife said, the pretty sound. I mean, really...pretty. As in, it hit me smack in the boo boo.

Each time I played last night and then about four runs through it today, it's already grown on me big time. I started playing some songs w/ the M-36 and then going to the OM2H for others. The light strum with singing was just really nice and it made me really start to appreciate it for what it does so well. I guess I would say it "clicked" and I hit a sweet spot. I've played it for about an hour this last go around and it's definitely staying.

I still plan to try some different strings as I tend to squeak a lot w/ these vs the Elixirs on my Martin. Those John Pearse I keep hearing about need to be given a shot. I'm also leaving it with the local luthier I trust and he's going to do a full set up on this week.

I'm really excited to have found what I hoped for in it. Thank you again to everyone for chiming in and offering such great advice. I don't spend enough time on AGF. Y'all are fine folks. Again, thank you.

[Treenewt]

Originally Posted by texrun38

I got some great advice from folks here as well as a friend in Montana that I called. The dealer said to absolutely change the strings. They knew they were original and they keep their guitars in cases (not out/on walls) until a customer asks to see one. Not knowing my preference for guauge, they put some D'Addario Phosphor Bronze EJ16 lights in the box. I put on the new strings then did what my friend suggested. Play it for a while, take a break, come back, play again, take a break, play something else, then sleep on it. Do the same on Sunday (today). I did just that. My wife heard me playing it w/ the new strings (obvious huge difference) and as she strolled by she said "that sounds really pretty". She also said "that sounds, well, prettier than your other guitar." I say, "Really. OK, well, which do you like better?" She says "I really like them both, but isn't the idea for them to be different?"



After the second break, I played flat picked/strummed, but I did it a bit lighter with the right hand and then...it happened. I did some singing with it. Just my voice and the guitar strummed with a light to medium strum. Holy cow! All of the sudden my ears started to hear the articulation, even-ness and just, I guess as my wife said, the pretty sound. I mean, really...pretty. As in, it hit me smack in the boo boo.



Each time I played last night and then about four runs through it today, it's already grown on me big time. I started playing some songs w/ the M-36 and then going to the OM2H for others. The light strum with singing was just really nice and it made me really start to appreciate it for what it does so well. I guess I would say it "clicked" and I hit a sweet spot. I've played it for about an hour this last go around and it's definitely staying.



I still plan to try some different strings as I tend to squeak a lot w/ these vs the Elixirs on my Martin. Those John Pearse I keep hearing about need to be given a shot. I'm also leaving it with the local luthier I trust and he's going to do a full set up on this week.



I'm really excited to have found what I hoped for in it. Thank you again to everyone for chiming in and offering such great advice. I don't spend enough time on AGF. Y'all are fine folks. Again, thank you.

Really glad it worked out for you!


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[BrunoBlack]

Good deal Texrun. I am a fan of Collings OMs and find they get better and better as you adjust your attack and the guitar matures. They might not be for everyone, but they are one of my favorites. I hope it continues to grow for you.