Waterloo vs IRIS OG

[bkan]

I need some help deciding on a 12 fret Waterloo of some sort (leaning toward a WL-S but open to WL12MH also) and an IRIS OG.

I haven't held or played either but my research tells me these are what I'm looking for. My understanding is the Waterloo will be a "one trick pony", but it also seems to be much more depending on your style of playing. I typically play with my thumb and index finger in a combination of strumming and Travis picking, but I am trying to learn more finger style.

Have any of you handled either, or both, enough to provide insight?

[cc132]

I’ve owned several Waterloos but have never played an Iris, unfortunately. From listening to many sound clips, I’m not convinced that the Iris will sound so dramatically different from your OMs to be a really worthwhile addition.

The Waterloos, on the other hand, will sound dramatically different.

[Shortfinger]

Here is a deluxe on Reverb, $7,500 plus shipping. https://reverb.com/p/waterloo-wl-s-d...arlor-acoustic

Buy it make sure there is a no questions asked return policy.

At the same time, buy this. Almost the same specs. Be sure to compare. It has a no questions asked 30 day return policy. And it is about five thousand less. Five thousand. Five zero zero zero. https://reverb.com/item/38360407-alv...tka-spruce-top

Play them both for three weeks, tell us which one you sent back.

[zmf]

Originally Posted by bkan

My understanding is the Waterloo will be a "one trick pony", but it also seems to be much more depending on your style of playing.

I think you have this right. Much depends on the tone you're after and the style you play. I tend to lean towards the "one trick pony" side of things. After playing a few, my first reaction (after being amazed at how light they are) was they're so darned cute. Great for light blues and ragtime. Haven't had the chance to explore what else they might be appropriate for.

But they are so easy and fun to play, I occasionally think of getting one, before Collings stopped making them, and they became so tough to find and relatively expensive.

Like you, I haven't played an Iris and am really curious about them.

[Mak2525]

From someone who has played both (albeit both 14 fret Waterloos), I think they both make great guitars - lightly built with thin finishes that make for very responsive & dynamic instruments. That being said, if choosing one, I would probably select the Iris OG simply because I think it is a much more versatile guitar. The OG has loads of sound from such a small bodied instrument. Very responsive to a light touch while still able to strum along with the best of them. The 25" scale length just seems to be perfect for the body, whether it's the 12 or 14 fret version.

Here's one of the best demo's I have heard for an Iris OG. This is from Larry @ Organic Sounds (a forum sponsor).

https://organicsoundsguitars.com/col...-mahogany-2020

[cc132]

Originally Posted by Shortfinger

Here is a deluxe on Reverb, $7,500 plus shipping. https://reverb.com/p/waterloo-wl-s-d...arlor-acoustic

Buy it make sure there is a no questions asked return policy.

At the same time, buy this. Almost the same specs. Be sure to compare. It has a no questions asked 30 day return policy. And it is about five thousand less. Five thousand. Five zero zero zero. https://reverb.com/item/38360407-alv...tka-spruce-top

Play them both for three weeks, tell us which one you sent back.

This is a silly comparison. You’re using a grossly inflated, highly desirable, extremely hard to find Waterloo - which, if sold at list price, would almost certainly be the most expensive Waterloo ever sold.

A new Waterloo WL-12 is $2,800.

[Mak2525]

Originally Posted by cc132

This is a silly comparison. You’re using a grossly inflated, highly desirable, extremely hard to find Waterloo - which, if sold at list price, would almost certainly be the most expensive Waterloo ever sold.

A new Waterloo WL-12 is $2,800.

I think you might have missed the sarcasm in his post. Don't think he was really comparing the two - just trying to make light of the ridiculous asking price for the $7500 Waterloo. Sometimes it's hard to pick up a tongue in cheek post without the inflection of a voice behind it. At least that's what I got from the post anyway.

[bkan]

Originally Posted by Shortfinger

Here is a deluxe on Reverb, $7,500 plus shipping. https://reverb.com/p/waterloo-wl-s-d...arlor-acoustic

Buy it make sure there is a no questions asked return policy.

At the same time, buy this. Almost the same specs. Be sure to compare. It has a no questions asked 30 day return policy. And it is about five thousand less. Five thousand. Five zero zero zero. https://reverb.com/item/38360407-alv...tka-spruce-top

Play them both for three weeks, tell us which one you sent back.

It would be ideal to play both at the same time but I just can't donate money to someone price gouging like that.

[bkan]

Originally Posted by cc132

I’ve owned several Waterloos but have never played an Iris, unfortunately. From listening to many sound clips, I’m not convinced that the Iris will sound so dramatically different from your OMs to be a really worthwhile addition.

The Waterloos, on the other hand, will sound dramatically different.

Thanks for reminding me I need to update my signature. The only guitar I have now is the D18.

[sinistral]

As the owner of two Waterloos (WL-S Deluxe and WL-14 LTR) and two Irises (CH and DF), I can say that you can’t go wrong with either. To say that Waterloos are “one trick ponies” doesn’t do them justice. Each model was designed to evoke a particular model of guitar from the 20’s/‘30’s/‘40’s, and they do that exceedingly well.

Certain Iris models might look like a pre-war Gibson, etc., but the construction and voicing are very different. And some models, like the CH, don’t have any historical precedents.

Iris has accumulated an impressive library of demo recordings:

Iris Guitar Co.—Videos

While the TNAG demos are always great, especially anything with Carl Miner, some of my favorite demos are by W Sound Guitar Store in Asia:

[mcmars]

I have 2 of each now, a WL-S and WL-K and a euro spruce B&S hog 12 fret OG Iris and recently got a Euro spruce maple B&S 14 fret OG Iris. I love them all! All very different from each other, all great guitars. The WL-S is just a great guitar for fingerstyle Blues/Rag/Folk. The WL-K is amazing and resonant guitar. that weighs 2.8 lbs! The Iris's have a unique tone that is really amazing and probably more versatile than the waterloos, more modern, but still has a vintage vibe. The Iris's are also noticeably light guitars.

You biggest issue is to find them now. Waterloos are not really being made in any kind of volume, if at all, seems a few get sent out every blue moon. There is a WL-S on the forum classifieds now if it did not sell. Iris's seem to come up more often and Iris keeps hiring new employees with skills to keep production going.

Really, IMHO, you can't go wrong with waterloo or Iris, but others here may differ. There are ergonomic differences, I like the 1 3/4 nut size all of my guitars have. I think the Iris feel a tad larger to my hand than the waterloo's, but it might be the full C neck versus the V on the WL-s and the thinner neck of the WL-K. I will have to pull out the calipers soon and see what the calipers say. I prefer the wider saddle string spacing on the Waterloo of 2 3/8's versus Iris 2 5/16", or the narrow option of 2 7/32", but I can deal with all of it just fine, just a preference. The build quality on both Iris and Waterloo is excellent, maybe tipping scale towards waterloo on some details. They both have the stew mac GA tuners which look nice but are stiff and difficult and worth upgrading. The woods are wonderful on Iris and waterloo, finish is similar open pore thin nitro, Iris is a flat finish and waterloo, more satin. With Iris you can get the beautiful Dale Fairbanks burst, but waterloos have their beauty, as well as finish upgrades, I really like my WL-S for the simple appointments and the old vintage vibe.

I think it might come down to availability and how much you want to spend. I am guessing you are thinking buying used as so hard to find new, at least for the waterloos. There are some retail stores that have orders in with Iris and they show up every few weeks somewhere. You can call Iris and ask them what they are finishing now and what store is about to get a certain model. That is how I got my slot-head 12 fret OG, I called to see if they had a 12 fretter OG and they were just finishing one of the first of them up and sending it out to TNAG.

Probably save some money buying an Iris if you can find a good used one at a fair price, the waterloos are like trying to find a hen's tooth now. Spend some time with headphones and listening to Youtube or hopefully and way better, try networking to see it you can try them out. I think tone is most important, but the ergonomics and feel is real close 2nd when I pick up a guitar. If I had a cyrstal ball I think it might say the WL-S and the OG slot-head 12 fret might be with me forever.