Eastman vs. Larrivee

[RP]

Originally Posted by mrkpower

What makes the JCL so special, than other L series?? Is the bracing different?

Jean Larrivee Guitars is proud to announce a re-issue guitar as part of their 40th Anniversary celebrations. This new model—simply dubbed the "JCL"—is a replica of the first steel string guitars Jean Larrivee made in the 1970's.

The instrument's features have been meticulously recreated to produce a historically accurate instrument. The "JCL's" features include Larrivee's own proprietary pattern marquetry rosette, matching back strip and tail strip, original style rosewood and holly purflings, and the Mother of Pearl "JCL Logo" on the headstock. Even the label inside the instrument has been recreated and color-matched to match the original 1970's label.

The bracing of the instrument has also been hand shaped, where possible, to the original specifications. The hardware of the guitar is no less impressive as the headstock features traditional Schaller M6 Tuners. Each guitar comes with a black, alligator texture, Canadian-made case featuring dark green velvet interior with a shroud and a brass Larrivee name plate.

[frankhond]

Interesting that the concern for employees and toxic waste is considered eccentric, greenpeacey, extra step...

Larrivee employees work under conditions conforming to north American standards. They may not be the greatest but still. Toxic material handling and other environmental measures are verifiable.

Eastman and other Asian brands are made by workers under slave-like conditions with little of no protective measures and non-verifiable handling of toxicity.

Just like the clothes I wear, the guitar I touch every day reminds me of the hands that made it. I don't want my money to promote adverse conditions, cancer, or environmental destruction. If that's eccentric, so be it.

I owned a couple Asian guitars a few years ago. After finding out a few things, I got rid of them, and will avoid for the foreseeable future.

I own a wonderful Larrivee. I have played a few Eastman in shops. They are very good but not really comparable to Larrivee because the construction, bracing, neck and tone are designed completely different.

The wood used in Asian factories is also not verified. Sometimes it is shipped from north America (so it travels from Asia to America and back, doubling the co2 used) and sometimes we don't know.

Jean Larrivee is one of the main importers and distributors of wood in north America. He personally selects logs on location. Martin, Taylor etc buys wood from him. Larrivee guitars have the best wood in America.

I guess you know by now where my vote is.

[slewis]

Frank, I admire your conscientiousness. It's not like we have to choose between (A) some very compromised quality and other factors in a north-American made guitar and (B) a far superior product made in China. Regardless of what quality might come out of China, I guarantee you that there's something comparable that can be acquired from a much more admirable source. I still cannot bring myself to buy a Chinese product (whenever possible); their government seems to be, from what I've seen and heard, not only ignorant of, but an accomplice to their business community's desire to steal, cheat and lie about anything to make a dollar (and for those of you who might choose to lecture me on the evils of American business, spare me; I'm aware of them but at least we have some degree of societal consciousness here). And I'm with you -- I'm not about to buy a product that even COULD be made by people who have no or little choice in their work environment. It does matter, to me. I think the clock is ticking though, sadly, for our ability to have choices like this.

[Stibay]

It is not so much the Brand as it is the guitar. You have to play it to know it is good one. I have played Larrivee guitars and they are wonderful but I found a really nice Eastman which, like noted earlier, has the capacity to inspire. Larrivee or Eastman...if you find a good one, you have found what you were looking for. Enjoy.

[shortymack]

Originally Posted by frankhond

Eastman and other Asian brands are made by workers under slave-like conditions with little of no protective measures and non-verifiable handling of toxicity.

.

Gimme a break.....Do these craftsmen look like 'slaves' to you? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtBlGRmnmJE

How does a simple guitar discussion turn political/environmental with unsubstanciated claims? Dont like a product for whatever reason, dont buy it, plain and simple end of story.

Might as well shut your computer off and take it to the dump cuz the majority of it is made in China.

[gitnoob]

Originally Posted by shortymack

How does a simple guitar discussion turn political/environmental with unsubstanciated claims?

I'm sure there are a lot of people who don't buy Martins because C.F. Martin was German. Makes sense to me.

[imwjl]

Originally Posted by shortymack

You called a guitar company and asked what they do with toxic waste to base your decision on buying a guitar? Maybe greenpeace needs to start building instruments.

Tonewise, which IMO is the number one factor in making a guitar purchase, Eastman wins between the two for me.

I don't know a whole lot about Greenpeace but would want instrument builders making my guitars. My being fond of small businesses and N. American businesses comes from owning my own small business in the US. My interest in work environments is not political as some may think. I remember some past jobs that were terrible, and the physicians who treated my cancer are very sure it was tied to chemical exposure from a job I had decades ago.

I am sure somebody in another part of the world might feel same as I do supporting family and domestic business, and I've encountered others who have had work experiences that influence their buying decisions. I would certainly not have enthusiasm for Larrivee guitars if they were not good guitars. I only knew cheap student instruments and my old Ovation prior to my first Larrivee that had better intonation, was more responsive, just a nice instrument.

[mc1]

..........

[jimmy bookout]

wow. So, a simple question about tone, playability, etc between Larrivee and Eastman turns into a bunch of political nonsense where NO ONE that is posting actually KNOWS the conditions that Eastman employees work under verses Larrivee employees.

To answer the ORIGINAL question, I find Larrivees a little over-built (I've owned 2), Eastmans are built very well and very lightly (I own 1 now). Both are nice guitars, I think Eastman is better. I certainly don't know the environmental/human rights impact of either maker (nor do I ASSUME the Chinese maker chains their workers to their benches while the Canadian/American builder does the right thing).

Jimmy

[TokyoNeko]

I'm not going to pretend to know what the working conditions are at Eastman. (I did visit Larrivee's Oxnard factory a few years back.) But if I were to categorize...

• Tone -- Larrivee (Subjectivity aside, it has to do with consistency, see below.)
• Fit & Finish -- Even
• Consistency -- Larrivee (Larrivees have consistently good tone; Eastmans have greater deviation between great boxes and duds.)
• Playability -- Even

In my book, Larrivee wins.

[gitnoob]

Originally Posted by TokyoNeko

Consistency -- Larrivee (Larrivees have consistently good tone; Eastmans have greater deviation between great boxes and duds.)

It would help if we knew how many examples of each you played.

I've probably played about 10 Eastmans (Eastmen?) and maybe 20 Larrivees.

In my experience, Eastman had a 20% dud rate, and Larrivee was probably closer to 30%.

But the good ones from both makers are very good.

[shortymack]

Originally Posted by mc1

wow, let's not forget you were the first to mention greenpeace.

.

Sorry but I wasnt the one to bring environmentalism into this thread, nice try.

I still think that its funny how those quick to point fingers pick and choose their gripes while typing away on a MIC PC. Double standards.

[leftync]

I respect someone who cares about the conditions under which his purchases are built.
Frankly, while the Eastmans are very nice, I don't see how they compare to Larrivees. A better comparison is Larrivee and Martin, beginning with the standard series, or Taylor, beginning with the 300 series. I've heard Larrivees that could be compared favorably with any guitar. The D-50 I own was built when Larrivee was a smaller company, and is very close in sound to the Santa Cruz Tony Rice model (in fairness, it was a comparably expensive guitar when new, and has aged nicely). The few D-03Rs I've heard (including one I owned and traded for the D-50) compared well with Collings guitars, and that's saying something. Larrivee makes an outstanding guitar; the fact that they are affordable makes them extraordinary.

[TokyoNeko]

Originally Posted by gitnoob

It would help if we knew how many examples of each you played.
I've probably played about 10 Eastmans (Eastmen?) and maybe 20 Larrivees.

I think my sample size is pretty close to yours.

Originally Posted by gitnoob

In my experience, Eastman had a 20% dud rate, and Larrivee was probably closer to 30%.

In my experience so far, Eastman is about 40%, Larrivee less than 10%.

Originally Posted by gitnoob

But the good ones from both makers are very good.

As I mentioned before, the last Eastman I played at McCabe's (E10OM) was excellent. Probably the best Larrivee I came across is the one I used to own (OM-50).

[mc1]

..........