Nut width is really not that useful of a spec...

[Kerbie]

It's of considerable importance to me...

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by mercy

Larry P has it, done. Close the thread.

True, but even when the question is answered correctly once, people will continue answering it, whether correctly or not as if the correct answer has not yet been provided. Ever watched how often the same bit of information is repeated in a thread?

Tony

[rmyAddison]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

I think string spacing is much more valuable to know. I have picked up many guitars with 1 3/4 nut widths that have different string spacing. There are some 1 3/4 nut width with the same string spacing as 1 11/16 and therefore essentially feel the same to play.

It seems that is much more important to know than nut width.

And I disagree 100%, two guitars with the same string spacing but one 1-11/16" nut and one 1-3/4" nut feel entirely different, and my arthritis agrees with me.

Nut width, string spacing and neck profile ALL count.......

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

...There are some 1 3/4 nut width with the same string spacing as 1 11/16 and therefore essentially feel the same to play...

Since the neck widths are different, the two will feel very different, regardless of string spacing.

...It seems that [string spacing] is much more important to know than nut width.

It helps to know both nut/neck width, as well as string spacing if you are ordering without being able to play the guitar first.

[GraceMusik]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

True, but even when the question is answered correctly once, people will continue answering it, whether correctly or not as if the correct answer has not yet been provided. Ever watched how often the same bit of information is repeated in a thread?

Tony

This is because many people don't read past post 1. Heck, some even don't read that before answering

[El Conquistador]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

It seems that is much more important to know than nut width.

Important to know for what purpose? As Larry has already said, if you are choosing a guitar from a rack of guitars, the best strategy is to buy the one that feels best and don't worry about why it feels best. So, I assume it is only important to know when you are either buying a guitar sight unseen, or, commissioning a guitar that doesn't even exist yet.

I would like to attempt to expand on Larry's premis that there is no single factor that renders a guitar neck comfortable, but rather it is a combination of factors. So, in addition to the factors Larry mentioned:

A guitar neck with a "V" profile or beefy shoulders will feel more playable with a narrower nut/string spacing while a neck with a shallow slim shouldered "D" profile will need to have a wider nut/string spacing to not feel cramped.

Fret height and shape effects play-ability a great deal.

String spacing not just string to string, but factors like E string position. Some people are thumb wrapper and want the top E to be a little closer to the edge while having the bottom E a little further from the edge to avoid pulling it off the fretboard. So a decision of equal spacing of strings center to center, edge to edge or a blend of both.

And finally, gloss or satin finish effects comfort.

I have commissioned several guitars and have found that the more I can communicate what I want to the builder, the happier I will be with the end product.

Steve

[drplayer]

Originally Posted by Todd Yates

...but I think string spacing at the nut as a spec is largely irrelevant.

Do you really?

Originally Posted by Todd Yates

If I like a guitar, but not the spacing at the nut, I can recut it or make a new nut to customize string spacing.

Apparently not... See, you're not a contrarian after all.


Kidding aside, it should be a given that any well made guitar will have adequate real estate for it's specific string spacing. So, if the string spacing was known to be to your liking from the get-go, it's really the nut width that becomes irrelevant, since real estate becomes a moot point. Therefore, I agree with the OP as it pertains to these two dimensions (which are the only two the OP was inquiring about).

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

Well said. I was exaggerating to make a point that nut width by itself, is not that valuable without considerating string spacing as well as the others you mentioned.

Hi PZ…

For me it's a most useful spec. I know I won't be buying an acoustic with less than 1¾" nut spacing.

I partially agree with the premise. I believe the string spacing at the nut and saddle both play into the mix, as well as neck profile. The spacing at the ends determines what it will be at the 12th fret, so I don't worry myself over that measure.

I'm able to play just fine on my Strat and Tele - both with 1¹¹/₁₆" nut spacing - but I'd never attempt to play fingerstyle on them - at least not the song arrangements I've mastered on acoustic.

And other acoustics with 1¹¹/₁₆" nut width that I do encounter make me work harder than my 1¾" nut personal guitars. It's more than just a little difference to me.

I know if I were buying an acoustic guitar which I actually expected to play with any proficiency in front of others it would have at least 1¾" nut. I wouldn't be buying a guitar that don't expect to play in front of others.

Originally Posted by drplayer

Do you really?

I'm saying it would make no difference in a purchase. If I liked the guitar (and neck) otherwise, but wanted the string spacing at the nut to be a little wider, narrower, equal distance, equal centers, or whatever, I'd just change/alter the nut. OTOH, if a guitar has a 1 5/8" nut width and I prefer a 1 3/4" nut, then I'm not interested because I know the neck is not physically wide enough. Rejecting a guitar because the string spacing (not neck width) at the nut doesn't suit you is like rejecting a new car because the seat is not adjusted the way you like.

[jim1960]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

Nut width is really not that useful of a spec...

That depends on the person. In my case, I have pretty thick fingers so I look for a wider nut. To play on a 1 3/4 nut I have to really think about my left hand to avoid inadvertently muting notes. I just had a parlor made with a 1 7/8 nut and it's a joy to play.

[Rosewood99]

Originally Posted by

It helps to know both nut/neck width, [I

as well as[/I] string spacing if you are ordering without being able to play the guitar first.

As I said, I was exaggerating. You are correct that both are important. That was really my point. I feel that nut width is given more importance when both need to be considered.

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by paulzoom

I think string spacing is much more valuable to know. I have picked up many guitars with 1 3/4 nut widths that have different string spacing. There are some 1 3/4 nut width with the same string spacing as 1 11/16 and therefore essentially feel the same to play.

It seems that is much more important to know than nut width.

Of course, but you run out of fretboard width real estate. Yes, you can increase the spacing of the strings at the nut, however before long you will fret the first string (perhaps even the sixth string) right off the side of the fretboard.

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by Larry Pattis

If you're going to take an approach other than "if it feels good, play it", and try to understand *why* it feels good you need the following...and understanding what works well for any given individual, measurement-wise, can be quite valuable, IMO:

1) Overall nut width

2) E-to-E string spacing at the nut

3) Overall width of fingerboard at 12th fret

4) E-to-E spacing at the bridge

5) Scale length

6) Fingerboard radius

7) Some idea about back of neck profile (shape), thickness of neck, etc.

Yes - whilst I always look for (1) first, other sensible aspects mentioned - (5) second, (7) third, and (4) third.
(3) is simply a factor of 1,5 and 7 and I confess I've never taken much consideration of fretboard radius as long as it has one.

A sound knowledge of all these mentioned are particularly essential to know before ordering a custom build ....as I now know to my cost!

[Rosewood99]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Of course, but you run out of fretboard width real estate. Yes, you can increase the spacing of the strings at the nut, however before long you will fret the first string (perhaps even the sixth string) right off the side of the fretboard.

You are actually supporting my premise. If you purchased your guitar using the string spacing as your primary spec, you would avoid the problem completely.

That's why both need to be taken into consideration. They are equally important.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by Todd Yates

…Rejecting a guitar because the string spacing (not neck width) at the nut doesn't suit you is like rejecting a new car because the seat is not adjusted the way you like.

Hi TY…
I pretty much disagree with your premise.

It's not like companies just build generic fingerboards to a single width with lots of spare room on the outsides for expansion so one can change out the nut to accommodate different string widths. And the bridge pin holes are fixed (they could be filled and re-drilled I suppose). Those bridge pin holes determine the path the strings will take down the neck regardless of what one does at the nut.

I've never personally seen a fingerboard on a 1¹¹/₁₆" properly spaced nut that had enough extra room to widen the string bed enough to accommodate the string spacing of a 1¾". It always laid one or other E string so close to the edge of the neck that it will get dragged or pushed over the edge.

There was a lot of discussion about widening the nut on the alleged 1.8" Seagull fingerboards, and what people discovered is the 1.8" is actually 46mm, and that calculates to 1.75" not 1.8".

French speaking Canada (where they were built) is on the metric system - as was the factory. Whomever maintained the website was converting the actual measurement of 46mm to 1.8" instead of 1.75, and there really was no extra fingerboard width.

While some adjustment is theoretically possible, the expense and trouble one has to go through to do any re-spacing makes it about as hard as changing out the entire seating structure in a new car, not merely pressing a button and moving the seat.