Yamaha acquires Guild

[srick]

Originally Posted by Tenn

You cannot improve distribution until you have more dealers willing to support the brand. My impression is that there are not a lot of dealers willing to take on the brand as sell through to the musician is not that great. Why? I do not know. But Guild has tried over the years. The latest effort was to bring Ren Ferguson from Gibson. That did not really work.

Somehow Guild must create a need to buy by the guitar playing public, which they have failed to do since the 70s in my mind.

Tenn - very true. But back in the Ren Ferguson days, Fender (who owned the brand at the time) was not a good fit as far as promoting the line.

Ren did amazing things with the line and he (and others) took an aging factory into a new era. It was amazing to see the transformation - I live about 20 miles from the former Ovation\Guild factory and watched it change over several years. But you're right. The demand wasn't there. Plus, Fender had its own acoustic line, Ovation, and the Guild GAD series all competing against each other. In retrospect, Fender's real motivation in acquiring Guild, Ovation and Hamer, may have been to acquire KMC Music which got sold to JAM in 2015. KMC carries a number of brands and is a very big distributor of music gear.

As you may know, Cordoba packed up the plant and moved it to Oxnard. Ovation was sold to Drumworks and then to GeWa. (I have no idea where Hamer went)

So again, I think the sale may be more one based on corporate turf, distribution networks and establishing a bigger footprint in Oxnard. And Tim Miklaucic (founder of Cordoba Guitars) may have wanted to get off the merry-go-round and agreed to the offer from an iconic company.

When I take a step back and look at the acoustic guitar business, it's pretty hard to fathom.: A quick look up shows Martin making 150,000 guitars per year, Taylor making at least that or more, and Gibson at about 170,000 (don't quote me on these numbers). That's incredible - where do they all go? Plus, guitars don't have an expiration date, so they're still out there.

To sum - it's a tough market. And fewer brick and mortar music stores leaves these brands all competing to get shelf space in Guitar Center, or a featured status on Sweetwater.

Rick

[TomB'sox]

On a lighter note, if alive, John Denver would likely have been happy. Think of the Guild/Yamaha combo they could have built for him!!!

[roadbiker]

Generally speaking, I have very high regard and respect for Yamaha. Everything that company makes is of a very high quality, from motorcycles to A/V receivers (I have used them exclusively for years and just bought an Aventage A6A), watersports stuff, and musical instruments. I have considered buying a Yamaha guitar from time to time and I think that they are fine instruments. That being said, I just hate to see an iconic American guitar company becoming part of a Japanese company. Based on what I have seen from Yamaha, I anticipate that the high quality standards of Guild (and Cordoba) will continue to excel under Yamaha, but it saddens me a little to see another company "sell out" to the Japanese. Kudos to Yamaha to the acquisition, and I do look forward to seeing the future of Guild.

[mcduffnw]

Originally Posted by TomB'sox

On a lighter note, if alive, John Denver would likely have been happy. Think of the Guild/Yamaha combo they could have built for him!!!

THAT would have been something to see and hear!!!!!!! Yet through the last 10 years of his life, John was using Taylor guitars, though the Denver/Deutschendorf family still had/has? the Guild 6 and 12 string guitars. The Yamaha L-53 got sold several times over...last time was about 2 years ago at Gruhns Guitars along with his John Greven 6 string.



Maybe Yamaha will someday do a Limited Edition Guild John Denver F-50R Artist Award model and a Limited Edition Guild John Denver F-612 model, and a Limited Edition Yamaha L-53 Custom model

...sigh...a fella can dream...and buy lottery tickets like a fiend {;-)


duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

[zmf]

Originally Posted by roadbiker

That being said, I just hate to see an iconic American guitar company becoming part of a Japanese company. Based on what I have seen from Yamaha, I anticipate that the high quality standards of Guild (and Cordoba) will continue to excel under Yamaha, but it saddens me a little to see another company "sell out" to the Japanese.

The better question to ask is why an "iconic American guitar company" can't find the resources/organization to remain an iconic American guitar company.

It's not so much selling out as surviving. Guild must be on it's 8th or 9th life by now.

[Tenn]

Originally Posted by srick

Tenn - very true. But back in the Ren Ferguson days, Fender (who owned the brand at the time) was not a good fit as far as promoting the line.

Ren did amazing things with the line and he (and others) took an aging factory into a new era......

Rick

They made some great guitars while Ren was there. I owned one of those slopes- cannot remember the model- that were new to the line. Really nice. Too bad they could not get the attention from the buying public.

[Joe Beamish]

Originally Posted by zmf

The better question to ask is why an "iconic American guitar company" can't find the resources/organization to remain an iconic American guitar company.

It's not so much selling out as surviving. Guild must be on it's 8th or 9th life by now.

Is it a case of being stuck in the middle? Of not competing at the high end or the low end. And possibly lacking a clear identity.

Not sure. I guess my first experience with Guild was having a friend buy a dread. It was…OK. Nothing more. But I’ve played some wonderful Guilds since then, and owned a marvelous jumbo.

It’s hard to compete when you don’t know who you are or what you stand for.

[zmf]

Originally Posted by Joe Beamish

Is it a case of being stuck in the middle? Of not competing at the high end or the low end. And possibly lacking a clear identity.

Not sure. I guess my first experience with Guild was having a friend buy a dread. It was…OK. Nothing more. But I’ve played some wonderful Guilds since then, and owned a marvelous jumbo.

It’s hard to compete when you don’t know who you are or what you stand for.

That's been my experience. I know I've auditioned at least one and it sounded good, but can't remember which model. I know I like the sound some of my favorite recording artists get from Guilds. That should be enough to move me in that direction.

But it's the identity thing re Martin and Gibson. I assume some Guild models are kind of like Martins and some are kind of like Gibsons. Why is the Guild brand even necessary? That's an overstatement, but when you're feeling GAS, it's easier to fixate on guitars that bring a strong mental image.

[High_Colorado]

Originally Posted by TomB'sox

On a lighter note, if alive, John Denver would likely have been happy. Think of the Guild/Yamaha combo they could have built for him!!!

This was in the Colorado History Museum (Denver) a few years back, not sure if it is still on display.

[KESTLY]

Well, as long as they keep producing the Nick Drake guitar (Guild M20) I'll be happy...

[srick]

Originally Posted by Tenn

They made some great guitars while Ren was there. I owned one of those slopes- cannot remember the model- that were new to the line. Really nice. Too bad they could not get the attention from the buying public.

The Guild ‘Orpheum’ - “the guitar that Guild would have built if they were around in the 1930s.”

[Joe Beamish]

Originally Posted by KESTLY

Well, as long as they keep producing the Nick Drake guitar (Guild M20) I'll be happy...

(Insert long digression about whether this was really the guitar that Nick Drake played.)

[mattwood]

I think this is a smart move by Yamaha which would be great for Guild in the long run. I think they will make them an even better guitar than they are and with guitar sales being projected as being higher in North America than anywhere else over the next 10 years, it gives Yamaha a traditional “American” line to manufacture in America. I think Guild will become a top-tier acoustic guitar line once again.

[mcduffnw]

Originally Posted by mattwood

I think this is a smart move by Yamaha which would be great for Guild in the long run. I think they will make them an even better guitar than they are and with guitar sales being projected as being higher in North America than anywhere else over the next 10 years, it gives Yamaha a traditional “American” line to manufacture in America. I think Guild will become a top-tier acoustic guitar line once again.

I don't know Matt, I think that China and the Orient might well be the next guitar hot spot, especially for acoustic guitars. I know several luthiers and China is really picking up steam for them on build orders. They have a young and growing, and hungry to con$ume things middle class, and they loves them some acoustic guitar in a big way.


duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

[mattwood]

Originally Posted by mcduffnw

I don't know Matt, I think that China and the Orient might well be the next guitar hot spot, especially for acoustic guitars. I know several luthiers and China is really picking up steam for them on build orders. They have a young and growing, and hungry to con$ume things middle class, and they loves them some acoustic guitar in a big way.


duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

According to this article you have been right but it predicts N. America to have a higher growth over the next 10 years for what it's worth. Interesting article that actually talks about YAMAHA. It also makes me think that used prices will stay high with demand.

https://www.grandviewresearch.com/in...-market-report