Play for free - pros and cons and stuff like that

[buddyhu]

Your jamming buddies just want to jam, not perform. Warts and all. Sounds like you are more performance oriented, and are willing to put the effort and focus into polishing some songs so that they are performance ready. Pretty much the end of the story.

If you can't feel comfortable just jamming in front of people, warts and all, then it seems your choice is clear. Regardless of the various ways of talking about this and thinking about this, it comes down to you feeling good about the experience, and if you feel crummy at the end of it, that is not good for you.

[The Growler]

Originally Posted by amyFB

We are just a little jam group. We don't play out; it's a weekly jam for the fun of music making together in a small group of just the three of us.

Only I play out; solo or with my duet partner, (who isn't in this jam group).

Neither of the others plays out. The few times previously it has come up in discussion, we end up in the same debate that triggered my post here today.

I think I'm reaching the conclusion that I have in the past, which is:

If the group isn't agreeable to working with a common purpose and set of performance quality standards, I don't want to play out with them.

thanks for all your comments, appreciate it!

I'm with you Amy. Playing out requires preparation and giving the audience your best, whether you're doing a favor for free or getting paid is what they deserve.

[amyFB]

Originally Posted by Daion78

I'm going to take a different tact here.

OP, you must have a lot of friends. You may truely feel that there are no hard feelings but you can't foresee the future.

Look, you like jamming with these guys you say you 'love' but you're planning to leave 'em in the lurch when playing music you've already said you pretty much carry. They will either not do it and miss the shared experience or soldier on without you. You have raised the practice issue so you can't just make up an unrelated excuse. All for your heightened sense (and so many others on here) of music business.

I sound harsh, I don't mean to be, but for myself I wish I had been inclusive rather than exclusive about my music.

You may lose and miss your friendly jam come some day.

Kirk

I am confident in my assessment that this is my 'problem'. The issues about playing out for the other two are completely different from mine, and were , at the outset , specifically excluded from this discussion.

I do not agree that I am leaving them in the lurch, because, 1) we were not actively seeking gigs; 2) the detractor said "maybe" to the venue on behalf of the group.

It was during our weekly jam that it came up for discussion and I was posting here to see if my gut reaction was supported by a majority of others who play out.

All is good in jam buddy land.

Thanks all!



Thanks again for all your input.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Acoustic Beatle]

Hi gang ! ye , these are the sort of issues that in my own experience break bands up . Always had a work ethic towards rehersal and good preparation.
The bonding as band members, the shared aspirations and comraderie all add to that "band of brothers" vibe as each song is arranged and finally honed. This only comes with quality time spent persuing common goals ,on a regular basis . All or nothing at all ,for me !! In a storm ? dump the excess baggage !!

Acoustic Beatle.

[williejohnson]

Originally Posted by amyFB

The main detractor (and original contact person for the gig) says it does not matter, no one will be listening and we're not getting paid.

Amy,
Whoever that person is, has no business performing in public and I certainly wouldn't want to be part of that train wreck.

Willie

[cyclistbrian]

Originally Posted by williejohnson

Amy,
Whoever that person is, has no business performing in public and I certainly wouldn't want to be part of that train wreck.

Willie

I agree 100%. I gig regularly and will do the occasional free gig for a friend. On those occasions for lack of a better term I am "gifting" them my time. Most people like gifts to have some value, even if the value is just the simple sentiment it came with, like when a kid gives his mom a picture he or she drew. So I will put on my best performance and that's that.

[Irish Pennant]

"We were asked if we wanted to have our weekly jam at a photography show."

Just say, "Let's compromise, we can have our weekly jam at the photographers living room. The photographer can take pictures of us jamming and display them at their show, nobody will be listening anyways so we really don't need to be there in person".

[Howard Emerson]

Amy,
Under no circumstances should you do an unpaid gig except as a volunteer at a hospital or retirement home.

Playing for nothing gives a very wrong impression, and I don't care how much the 'host' doesn't care about quality.

Anything worth doing is worth doing well, and you should be paid for your effort.

Period.

HE

[RCGuitar]

I too am in a similar situation. I have played semi professionally in the bucks county PA area for years. The current line up I'm playing with is nothing more than hacks (2 of the 4). They book cheap paying gigs, are rude to me, bring 10 other guys in to play for a gig paying for 3, and then tell me they need to split the money 10 ways. It's not cool with me, I might as well play in a garage band. Theses guys I have known for a while too, previous friends first. My point is, if they are not meeting your needs (paid or unpaid) then part ways and find some people that will be professional. Personally I'm looking to do the same thing right now...the past several gigs have included them bringing in hack player friends and then turning each song into a "jam" while they each take turns soloing and skip right over me like I wasn't there. I can't play with rude and ignorant people. I also play solo and with another band and we don't have these issues.

[RCGuitar]

Originally Posted by Howard Emerson

Amy,
Under no circumstances should you do an unpaid gig except as a volunteer at a hospital or retirement home.

Playing for nothing gives a very wrong impression, and I don't care how much the 'host' doesn't care about quality.

Anything worth doing is worth doing well, and you should be paid for your effort.

Period.

HE

I also agree with this. It sends the wrong message to perspective customers who feel they can get you on the cheap. It hurts musicians in general. The guys I'm playing with are happy playing for free or for beer because it keeps the ego inflated

[J Patrick]

...in my experience..any musical collaboration thats worth the time and effort requires a bond that is working for all the musicians involved...if that bond isn't there its best to move on...its an intimate relationship of sorts and at the end of the day joy is the most that anyone can take from playing music....if it ain't fun don't do it... thats my motto...unless it pays really well...

[slewis]

Originally Posted by Lacks Focus

To me, the fact that you're not getting paid, and doing this as a "favor" is irrelevant. There will be people hearing (if not listening). That alone is all it would take for me to feel a need to prepare and to do my best.

THIS, THIS, THIS. Listening closely or not, every person attending this event will be under the (logical) assumption that you're performing -- which you are -- and that alone is enough to present your best. It's not like you're sitting around a campfire with some friends noodling... That's my two cents.

[slewis]

Originally Posted by Howard Emerson

Amy, Under no circumstances should you do an unpaid gig except as a volunteer at a hospital or retirement home. Playing for nothing gives a very wrong impression, and I don't care how much the 'host' doesn't care about quality. Anything worth doing is worth doing well, and you should be paid for your effort. Period.
HE

I essentially agree with this -- the only exception being that if you are brand new to gigging and "exposure" is of value to you -- which it clearly can be -- well then, you have a choice to make. You're getting something you value and the venue is is too. The free market. People barter things; it's the same concept. However, when's the last time you went to a catered event and heard that the caterer is doing it for free -- for "exposure?" Or the house painter, or the accountant, or the PA system rental guy? Rarely, if ever. It would indeed be nice if any musician worth hearing was being compensated in dollars, like pretty much the rest of the world.

[woodbox]

It appears that Amy got all that was requested from this thread, and has thanked the contributors a number of times.

But it's a topic that has touched many of us, myself included, and we keep talking about it--even though Lacks Focus and GibbyPrague nailed it all down on page one and most of us have been singing harmony since then, and Sean (slewis) just tied it all up.

It's hard to get creative people going the same direction at the same time for very long.

There's playing, then there's performing.
If you're not going to hang it out there,
don't go out there.

[Gypsyblue]

I like to be well prepared and well rehearsed anytime I play out.

I do it because I want to please both myself and the listeners.

Doesn't matter if it's a paid or free gig.

If I'm going to put myself up there in front of people I want it to be good.

It hurts to suck. I wind up being depressed for days...or until the next gig when I can redeem myself to myself.