What's louder: mahogany or rosewood?

[guild272]

Hi,

My name is Gerben, I'm from the Netherlands and just entered the forum. I've been playing guitar for over 25 years and mostly play electric, but I get more interested in acoustics by the day.
The acoustics I own are a Guild F1512E 12-string and a Martin GPCRSGT.

Could anyone tell me if there's a difference in volume too between Rosewood and Mahogany?

[Rodger Knox]

How much volume a guitar produces is almost independent of the back and side material.

[bizango1]

I have OM sized guitars-some have Rosewood and some have Mahogany. Some of the RWs are louder than some of the Hogs and some of the Hogs are louder than some of the RWs so you can't always say one type of wood is louder than another. In fact my loudest OM is Hog and my quietest is also Hog.

[guild272]

Clear. Thank you.

[zabdart]

It's not the wood, so much as the size and shape of the body, how heavily (or lightly) the top is braced and how heavily you pick that's going to determine the volume of your sound. Think about it: the bigger the box of air, the more air that's in it to vibrate and the more air that should come out of the soundhole, thereby producing more volume. If you're talking about the response of an SBT or UST, you're cheating.

[Bax Burgess]

Is an impression of volume dependent on more than a single factor? For instance, does a full, rounded note that registers highest on a meter deliver more impact to the ear than a lesser volume note that attenuates more quickly after having been struck/played? For me, rosewood approximates the latter, while mahogany is more the former.

[inadu ridge]

Originally Posted by Bax Burgess

Is an impression of volume dependent on more than a single factor? For instance, does a full, rounded note that registers highest on a meter deliver more impact to the ear than a lesser volume note that attenuates more quickly after having been struck/played? For me, rosewood approximates the latter, while mahogany is more the former.

Interesting. My opinion is that rosewood is the former, while mahogany is the latter.

[Howard Klepper]

Volume and loudness are not the same thing.

Volume is a measure of the intensity of sound pressure. It is a physical quantity--what is going on in the air.

Loudness is a perception of the human ear-brain system. It has a relation to volume, of course, but varies greatly depending on the frequency of the sound, since the ear is most sensitive in the region around 3,000 Hz. It also varies with the rise time and duration of the sound. There is a good short article about loudness in Wikipedia.

For guitars, the picture is also complicated by other sounds that are present which affect the perception of the guitar's loudness, such as other musical instruments playing. "Cutting through the mix" is a complex subject.

We happen to have an expert on this subject who shows up now and again on the forum, named Tom. I haven't seen him recently. His handle is TPBii

[jseth]

As some have stated, the back and sides have little to do with the overall volume a guitar produces...

In my experience, it is the BUILDER of the guitar that will determine the loudness and volume of any instrument... irrespective of the wood used in construction, although, certainly, the size/shape of the guitar will make a huge difference.

[Gmountain]

There is a difference in sound , or tone, between the two though.

[Wade Hampton]

Howard wrote:

Originally Posted by Howard Klepper

Volume and loudness are not the same thing.

Volume is a measure of the intensity of sound pressure. It is a physical quantity--what is going on in the air.

Loudness is a perception of the human ear-brain system. It has a relation to volume, of course, but varies greatly depending on the frequency of the sound, since the ear is most sensitive in the region around 3,000 Hz. It also varies with the rise time and duration of the sound. There is a good short article about loudness in Wikipedia.

For guitars, the picture is also complicated by other sounds that are present which affect the perception of the guitar's loudness, such as other musical instruments playing. "Cutting through the mix" is a complex subject.

True. For me projection and volume and loudness are all different things.

One interesting example of this might be the Martin D-35. These are rosewood dreadnoughts that tend to have a MASSIVE sound when you're standing right in front of them, but because they have so much going on with the overtones they produce they don't actually project very well. I've sat six feet from a friend playing a D-35, with the soundhole pointed right at my ear, and been almost unable to hear them when there are several other instruments playing at the same time.

It's a complex subject.


Wade Hampton Miller

[Bax Burgess]

Originally Posted by inadu ridge

Interesting. My opinion is that rosewood is the former, while mahogany is the latter.

Rosewood strikes me as delivering a tighter note than mahogany. I'd steer towards Cedar and Rosewood for a tight sound. What is your preferred pairing?

[Wade Hampton]

Howard wrote:

Originally Posted by Howard Klepper

Volume and loudness are not the same thing.

Volume is a measure of the intensity of sound pressure. It is a physical quantity--what is going on in the air.

Loudness is a perception of the human ear-brain system. It has a relation to volume, of course, but varies greatly depending on the frequency of the sound, since the ear is most sensitive in the region around 3,000 Hz. It also varies with the rise time and duration of the sound. There is a good short article about loudness in Wikipedia.

For guitars, the picture is also complicated by other sounds that are present which affect the perception of the guitar's loudness, such as other musical instruments playing. "Cutting through the mix" is a complex subject.

True. For me projection and volume and loudness are all different things.

One interesting example of this might be the Martin D-35. These are rosewood dreadnoughts that tend to have a MASSIVE sound when you're standing right in front of them, but because they have so much going on with the overtones they produce, they don't actually project very well. I've sat six feet from a friend playing a D-35, with the soundhole pointed right at my ear, and been almost unable to hear them when there are several other instruments playing at the same time.

When there's a lot going on musically, it can be difficult to pick out exactly what the D-35 is doing, simply because there are a lot of overtones flying around.

It's a complex subject.


Wade Hampton Miller

PS: Greetings from Alaska, Gerben - it's always nice having Dutch people on the forum. I've changed planes at the Amsterdam airport a couple of times, but I'm not sure if that qualifies as visiting the Netherlands!

[rogthefrog]

Originally Posted by Bax Burgess

Rosewood strikes me as delivering a tighter note than mahogany. I'd steer towards Cedar and Rosewood for a tight sound. What is your preferred pairing?

What does "tight" mean?

[Bax Burgess]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

What does "tight" mean?

A defined note, restrained, yet not lacking power. The most extreme of this for me is a Koa top and back that I've even read described as being nasally, which isn't saying that it's dull/flat, but constrained.