What is your price ceiling for M.I.C. guitars?

[Charmed Life Picks]

Years ago I shared the video below of a tour of Yamaha's guitar factory in China. At the time they were pumping out 500,000 guitars a year out of this plant. People really liked this vid, so I'm posting it again.

[rllink]

My niece was made in China and they don't come any better. I have an Epiphone Les Paul and my friend has a Gibson. The two are equal in every way. My Guild is MIC and it is as high quality as the ones coming out of the US factory. I'm going to step out on a limb and say that MIC may have meant inferior quality at one time, but my opinion is that these days US made means over priced. Sorry if that offends anyone, but I embraced the global economy a long time ago.

[Charmed Life Picks]

Originally Posted by rllink

My niece was made in China and they don't come any better. I have an Epiphone Les Paul and my friend has a Gibson. The two are equal in every way. My Guild is MIC and it is as high quality as the ones coming out of the US factory. I'm going to step out on a limb and say that MIC may have meant inferior quality at one time, but my opinion is that these days US made means over priced. Sorry if that offends anyone, but I embraced the global economy a long time ago.

I've heard EXACTLY that statement about the Epi vs Les Paul Gibbies, many times. And a lot of major name artists are now endorsing Epiphone LPs instead of (or addition to) their American-made cousins. In fact the "Slash Collection," for one, sports three models, one of which is an Epi J-45 flat top clone.

Again, I am SO THRILLED to see Gibson doing well. They are vital to our industry.

sm

[Honkycat]

Originally Posted by Charmed Life Picks

Years ago I shared the video below of a tour of Yamaha's guitar factory in China. At the time they were pumping out 500,000 guitars a year out of this plant. People really liked this vid, so I'm posting it again.

Really interesting, thanks for that!

[Stonehauler]

Originally Posted by Matt82

About 10 years ago I bought a few cheap Chinese guitars(Epiphones, fenders, Ibanez, etc.), and they were just junk. That’s where I picked up the distaste for Chinese made stuff. Then I got a couple of seagulls and they were great, though lately it seems like seagull has fallen back a step, but still good.

Never seen an Eastman, or a Blueridge in the wild so I can’t speak for them, but I know Chinese manufacturers are definitely stepping up now. Also I’ve learned that companies like Epiphone have multiple suppliers for their low end guitars(or so I’ve heard)

Maybe it’s just some brands and low end stuff that sucks. Who knows

My Epiphone Sheraton II Pro was made in their Indonesian plant. It 's really good quality IMO, and I would put it up against most 335s out there in terms of quality.

That said, I've seen some entry level Epiphone "SG" types that I would not spend 200 bucks on.

It's the old adage. You get what you pay for. If your only concern is getting the cheapest guitar of that type, it's going to be junk no matter where it's made. That's because they don't have the budget to spend the time/money ensuring that the small things that separate a good quality guitar from a poor quality one, such as ensuring that the nut slots are cut right and the strings are sliding easily through. Like ensuring the frets are not sharp on the edge of the fretboard. Getting a good quality action set. Dialing in the intonation, etc.

When looking at a guitar in the store and you are looking at the price, think about all the things that you will need as you take that guitar home. Does it come with a gig-bag or a case? Does it need a setup?. Are you going to be replacing the bridge or nut with Tusq, bone, or brass? Do you need to get a fret-job, change out the tuners, etc.

All that costs money, so if you get an all good solid wood MIC guitar for 1000 bucks and don't have to spend a ton of cash after purchase doing the above, or buy a HPL MIC for 500 and have to spend 3-400 more on all the accessories/improvements (including labor), are you really getting a good deal?

(edit, just using Sweetwater as a guide, since their prices are readily available on their site)
80 bucks - bone or tusq nut
80 bucks - bone or tusq saddle
60 bucks - setup
40 bucks - filing the fret ends smooth
190 bucks (removing the setup cost since it's already accounted for above) - level, crown, and polish the frets.
110 bucks - cheapest hardshell case

so, about 450 bucks just to upgrade from plastic to bone (or Tusq), and fix the fretboard to where it should have been from the factory. - so my above estimate is low...it's 450-560 depending on if you want a case...Plus the cost of your new strings. (those are not free either) - so is a "cheap" MIC guitar (or really, any cheap guitar no matter where it's made) really a good deal? If ANYTHING, MIC guitars have more of a price floor.

[jpd]

Originally Posted by perttime

Price ceiling does not depend on "where was it made". It depends on "how good is it".

Well said!.............

[FingahPickah]

Originally Posted by perttime

Price ceiling does not depend on "where was it made". It depends on "how good is it".

I second (or third) "that emotion"....

[Matt82]

I guess it comes down to which companies produce more duds. I know every guitar is different of course, but some companies are more inconsistent than others. A whole other thread could be started on that subject alone.

[Robin, Wales]

I do like makers that are not trying to be a copy of something else but are ploughing their own furrow. It is why I like the Godin range of guitars. Chinese guitar production has been renound for making great copies of X or Y. I'd be interested to see if that matures into Chinese guitar manufacturers holding their own space rather than being followers. Perhaps Eastman and, to some extent Blueridge are doing so.

In this vien I wouldn't count Yamaha as Chinese, nor other companies using China for production, as I'm thinking more of Chinese owned guitar makers.

Just to add. It would be nice to see some high volumes of low to mid priced acoustic guitars coming from some European countries too!

[Charmed Life Picks]

Interesting comment, Robin. I definitely see Yamaha as a Japanese company, but they have certainly found the need to go elsewhere to hit the price points they need. No one can fault them for that. I certainly don't.

sm

[Jim Comeaux]

I have an LL-16 ARE (the plain Jane version with a soft sided case and without the abalone bling around the top binding. Firstly I really do think that the plain version looks better than the bling version, and I saved $300. Secondly, this is the best guitar that I own. By that I mean that I do not have anything “better” to compare it to on a side by side basis, but I am over the moon about this guitar. It is great! The only changes that I made were to replace the saddle and the bridge pins with bone ones. Oh, and I even like the soft sided case. I had only the old style wooden type cases that are clumsy and heavy. The foam sided case was a real epiphany for me.

[bobster7]

Whatever it needs to be to get the guitar I like. With Eastman and the all solid sigma guitars your getting a lot for your money already whatever the cost, I’m more cautious of spending big on US brands these days to be honest given the extortionate prices and average quality control many exhibit.

[Brent Hutto]

Originally Posted by bobster7

Whatever it needs to be to get the guitar I like. With Eastman and the all solid sigma guitars you get a lot for your money whatever the cost, I’m more cautious of spending big on US brands these days to be honest given the extortionate prices and average quality control many exhibit.

Given the frequency with which I've seen people posting online about big-name "made in USA" guitars from the likes of Gibson, Martin and Fender that should never have been allowed out the factory door, I've pretty much got a "price ceiling" for any mass-produced instrument. It's touching that people think the factory being located in the USA somehow guarantees quality when that is manifestly not the case.

So yeah, I'm not willing to spend two grand on a guitar produced in a Chinese factory. But I'm also not willing to spend two grand on a guitar produced in a USA factory. I have, however, spent more than two grand on instruments made by a guy in Montana or a guy in Kansas sitting in a workshop doing their thing to fastidious craftsman standards.

[rokdog49]

With inflation, two grand today is not the same as it was even ten years ago let alone further back than that.
My formerly-owned (sadly) Eastman E20D at around $1000 then was every bit and in some ways more the guitar my current
2017 D18 (with the binding coming loose) is in build, quality and playing enjoyment.
The biggest difference in the price between the two was the cost of the labor which in the U.S. is astronomically higher due to inflation and other things we won’t discuss here.
What’s more stunning is that the manufacturing process of the Martin was half as labor intense as the Eastman to begin with. In effect, the Eastman was was mostly hand made.
I would still pay the going price at $1500 give or take, for a new Eastman E20 D without batting an eye. That’s a steal in todays dollars.