What is your price ceiling for M.I.C. guitars?

[musicman1951]

I have not played an LL16, but I personally prefer Yamaha instruments made in Japan.

[rllink]

Those numbers seem so arbitrary. Was there a reasoning behind the $300 rule? Why even have such a rule if it obviously had no meaning? I think to enjoy your new guitar you are going to have to get past that, which you haven't or you wouldn't be questioning yourself about it here. Either that or you will be selling it in a few months for no good reason.

[stormin1155]

We need to get over the notion that only US craftsmen.... or Japanese... or Canadian... or... can build quality guitars. Chinese craftsmen were building musical instruments centuries before Europeans ever set foot on America.

[TTiimm]

Originally Posted by Matt82

I think I’m still shaking off the bad reputation that MIC guitars had 20 years ago. I know that manufacturing has gotten a lot better since then. Also I’ve heard yamahas QC is pretty strong.

I would encourage you to play an Eastman.

It might not be the guitar for you but it would provide another data point in the guitar search.

[R22]

I recently spent $1200 on an Eastman E6OM-TC. I had been looking for a 000 size. My budget was around $3000. I got the Eastman because specs were perfect for me. Would I have paid $3000 for it? No. It would have had to knock me over with tone to consider that. So far I haven't fallen over while playing it, so.....

I do feel that it was worth what I paid for it, regardless of where it was made.

[Brent Hutto]

Last year I bought an Eastman E1D which is made in China (of course) and not quite their entry level but like one level up from that. It's as well made as any factory instrument I've owned. Zero setup issues, good fretwork, no problems since I've owned it. Sound pretty good, plays great. It was $500-something and based on that experience I'd be perfectly fine with an "made in China" guitar at a more expensive price range as long as it was an Eastman.

Generically speaking, non-Eastman, I'd be more cautious maybe. I recently bought a made-in-China Schecter electric guitar and it has some quality control issues. Ended up returning it. Nowhere near Eastman quality (although it was a much cheaper guitar).

Again, ignoring Eastman for the moment, the established big brands seem to really cut corners on the models they choose to manufacture in China. I don't think a Chinese factory is necessarily going to do worse manufacturing than an Indonesian, Korean, Taiwanese or Mexican factory. But most brands are going to source guitars in China where they cut every possible corner on components and materials. If they are going to use better "stuff" they tend to also manufacture them elsewhere than China.

Or so it seems to me. I think it's a "chicken or egg" thing. These companies know people are willing to pay more for non-China origin so they tend to allocate production with that in mind. Which reinforces that perception. Eastman in that sense is the exception that proves the rule (in the exceptio probat regulam in casibus non exceptis sense of the term).

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by Matt82

I recently ordered a Yamaha FG5, and as part of a promo got a discount on an LL16. The LL is of course solid wood, but made in China. I’m left wondering if 800 is too much to put on a Chinese built guitar. I know they’ve done better in recent years, and I’ve heard great things about the LL, but my old rule was nothing over 300 for MIC.

Just wondering what everyone else’s thoughts are, as well as any input on the LL16.

Hi Matt

I believe several nicely built guitar brands, Eastman and Walden, are made in China. Avian guitars are built there as well (if they are still in business).

I'm guessing there are capable guitar builders from many countries around the globe.

My wife & I wanted to buy our daughter-in-law a new guitar (she had a particularly bad one from 15 years back when she was in high school picked for the color), so I took her to a great little shop in Des Moines, IA and the after an hour of playing most of the in-stock-on-the-wall instruments, the owner wandered in with three Waldens. Wow, they took over the room even above some of the Guilds, and an hour later we walked away with a Mahogany/Cedar model which really fits her voice and style.

Didn't know till a week later they are made in China, and didn't care either. Great guitar.

[rmp]

somewhere around $1k.

I have a few examples to share and the results of the purchase, may or may not be relevant..

MIC Guild 12 string (F1512) They run a grand.. It's a fine guitar, but boy howdy! did it need a setup. Comes w/a decent hard/soft bag, I bought a Gator jumbo case.

MIC Shearton Pro II $699, no case, so you have to add about another $120 for that. Nice guitar, but needed some fret leveling to get the action right. Everything else is good, (Pickups, hardware, fit/finish)

By way of comparison.

My MIK Gretsch was about a grand (no case, so add another $150 for that)
The out of the box setup was superior to the other two. The Gretsch DID need some work on the nut, but that's it.

so for the same money (IMHO) an MIK guitar might take the edge, at least in my case...

That all said all of the imports are much better.

Considering some of the Hallelujah's I'm seeing from the US builders, there's no huge gap in QC anymore, in fact, the imports are edging out some of the USA products.

[rollypolly]

I don't know. I 've become a fan of Recording King guitars since they're usually less expensive, and they aren't really competing with expensive makes so they have a place in my heart.

For the right model I might be willing to go around 500-600. Any more and I start to think about what I could get in a Martin, or just save the money and be content. Eastmans are very nice and I may be wiling to go to 700-800 for one of their all gloss OMs.

[Rosewood99]

I thought the Yamaha’s were made in Japan not China.

Correction, they are made in China.

[Steve DeRosa]

If you're after a well-made, good-sounding, inexpensive carved archtop - the kind the big American (and a couple European) companies used to make in the '30s-60s - China (Loar, Eastman) is the only real game in town...

[rmp]

Originally Posted by Rosewood99

I thought the Yamaha’s were made in Japan not China.

Correction, they are made in China.

I guess it's Kind of like Gretch,

the "Consumer" line are MIK and MIC, (more affordable < to $1k )

the "Professional" series are MIJ ($2k and up)

[R22]

The Fg5 and Fs5 series are mij and well under $2k.

[JB200]

I think sub $1,000, the MIC stuff is the best deal going. Alvarez Masterworks, Yamaha LL, and Recording King RD-318/328 are all seriously well made all solid guitars that are great values and are under $1k. Eastman as well I'm sure, but I've never played an Eastman and some of their models are quite a bit more than $1k. Blueridge as well, they have some nice stuff but once prices start getting into the $1,500 or so range, you have to start thinking you aren't far off from a clean used Martin or Gibson.

[Dru Edwards]

Originally Posted by Wellington

All I'm gonna say is my LL16 cost me $900 CAD brand new a few years ago, now they're $1150 CAD brand new and it's completely still worth it. Very solid and cleanly built guitar, plays and sounds great if you like rosewood. No finish flaws on mine, whereas my $3000 Guild does have finish flaws, not that they matter to me at all.

I bought my LL16 at L&M back in Nov and you're right, it's a great guitar at a great price point. I'm expecting my next Yamaha to be the MIJ FG5 or FS5 if I can ever find one in stock.